Somalia at a point of no return?

[Mintid Farayar]

^^^

 

Ceebtooda ma aha, ee waa .....

[Abwaan]

Ilaahay rajadiis lagama quusto!

[Dhagax-Tuur]

^Saxiix. But then again, we're only human. But sometimes, when you think of where Somalia is, you can't help but wonder if, as is said, this is the end of the road.

 

I guess it is a case of 'madax muuqdo iyo midi saawir ahbo midna lagama quusto' therefore Alle raxmadi yeynaan marna ka quusanin.

[Peace Action]

A Good question that is in the mind of all sincere Somalis. May be the solution will come when the old generation passes away as in the 40 years when God made the jews to wander. I hope we don't have to wait another 20 years.

[Abu-Salman]

Somaliland's judiciary which is appointed by the President and approved by the parliament

Are you convincing us fellow Hargeysawi that there is a "parliament" to begin with, given the unelected Gurti terms self-extensions, the arbitrary limitation of parties or the level of state control on everything under the sun?

But then again, even the executive legitimacy is not beyond controversy...

 

Anyway, I'm not much into that sort of "Democracy", whose current or Islamic relevance is at best debatable, but would rather appreciate instead an enumeration of concrete results in terms of better accountability and transparency, healthcare and traffic security, water supply and farms productivity etc.

 

Should not there be something to show for all those NGOs let loose or churchs initiated "awareness" projects, concomitant with the dilution of local norms and traditions?

[The Zack]

Somalia will return and there is no doubt about that, it is just a matter of time. We hope it comes back in our life time.

[Kamaavi]

The peace and stability in the Horn, as well, the return of Somalia can be reached through resolultion of Somaligalbeed's conflict.

 

After over 40 years of soul searching, it is becoming clear that the issue of O'gadenia is at the forefront of resolving compounding security problems in the Horn. I hope all political and security leaders of the Horn understand that and come up with a fine formula to resolve this longstanding problem.

 

A simple and free referendum can do magic results, I guess.

[AfricaOwn]

Originally posted by Norfsky:

With the current status quo and the ever increasing instability through all Somali parts (SL, PL, South Somalia, OG region), what is the way forward?

 

Are we really at a point of no return?

Why are you including SL in the mix? SL can have its own problems without tying it to Somalia's problems..no? Burco should be ashamed of you.

[Thankful]

Because they are still part of Somalia :confused: , a vital part to. They show everyone else it is pointless of declare yourself independant. Because in almost 20 years it's got them no where.

[AfricaOwn]

^^It got me at a better state than the other option.

[Kamaavi]

^Easier to say (goodbye to Somalia) But where is the act of forgiveness? Hold her for a while sxb!

[Suldaanka]

Are you convincing us fellow Hargeysawi that there is a "parliament" to begin with, given the unelected Gurti terms self-extensions, the arbitrary limitation of parties or the level of state control on everything under the sun?

But then again, even the executive legitimacy is not beyond controversy...

Another hubble-telescope moment?

 

You were looking into the troubled TFG with an eye of an optimist in your earlier post so I must think that you also believe the 400+ member parliament is a real one?

 

There is no one denying that there is shortcomings and setbacks in Somaliland. But when one puts in perspective those shortcomings with that of TFG's and other parts of what used to Somalia, SL's shortcomings are minuscule. I am not here to diminish or belittle the scale of Somaliland's shortcomings in anyway, in fact they are major.

 

As for the un-elected Guurti. I ,for one, is for the House of Guurti to remain as it is, until such time the elected Lower House of Parliament becomes solid and proves that it can professionally manage its affairs without breaking into voilent confrontations. This will take a long time, but until such time, Somaliland can not afford to have its Upper House and Lower House as fueding grounds.

 

Anyway, I'm not much into that sort of "Democracy", whose current or Islamic relevance is at best debatable, but would rather appreciate instead an enumeration of concrete results in terms of better accountability and transparency, healthcare and traffic security, water supply and farms productivity etc.

There is an old Somali adage which goes: habar fadhida legdin wax uga fudud. In hindsight, it is good to think big but the reality on the ground dictates what the government can do. A realistic person is one that looks at the given issue from a hollistic approach - perhaps you might look inwards and think a little bit more about the huge challenges faced by the government and local government - from collecting tax to managing land disputes and anything in between. It is easy to recite jargon such as healthcare, traffic security etc etc but in practice it is whole different issue.

 

Should not there be something to show for all those NGOs let loose or churchs initiated "awareness" projects, concomitant with the dilution of local norms and traditions?

What are you suggesting? And what prove do you have for your fears?

 

In your earlier post, you mentioned about something you called as "cultural liberation", I assume you are refering to "Ethiopianisation". I don't have any fears about the Ethiopians in Somaliland. For one, there was always Ethiopians in Somaliland be it under the "Soomaali Aabo" banner or now the "Economic Refugee" banner, they are people forced by globalisation or regionalisation.

 

If you have xenophobia about foreigners, that is understandable.

[N.O.R.F]

Originally posted by AfricaOwn:

quote:Originally posted by Norfsky:

With the current status quo and the ever increasing instability through all Somali parts (SL, PL, South Somalia, OG region), what is the way forward?

 

Are we really at a point of no return?

Why are you including SL in the mix? SL can have its own problems without tying it to Somalia's problems..no? Burco should be ashamed of you.

 

Take off those rose tinted glasses saxib.

[Abu-Salman]

Originally posted by Suldaanka:

 

[...]

But when one puts in perspective those shortcomings with that of TFG's and other parts of what used to Somalia, SL's shortcomings are minuscule

. I am not here to diminish or belittle the scale of Somaliland's shortcomings in anyway, in fact they are major.

 

As for the un-elected Guurti. I ,for one, is for the House of Guurti to remain as it is, until such time the elected Lower House of Parliament becomes solid and proves that it can professionally manage its affairs without breaking into voilent confrontations. This will take a long time, but until such time, Somaliland can not afford to have its Upper House and Lower House as fueding grounds.

 

 

quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Anyway, I'm not much into that sort of "Democracy", whose current or Islamic relevance is at best debatable, but would rather appreciate instead an enumeration of concrete results in terms of better accountability and transparency, healthcare and traffic security, water supply and farms productivity etc.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

There is an old Somali adage which goes: habar fadhida legdin wax uga fudud. In hindsight, it is good to think big but the reality on the ground dictates what the government can do. A realistic person is one that looks at the given issue from a hollistic approach - perhaps you might look inwards and think a little bit more about the huge challenges faced by the government and local government - from collecting tax to managing land disputes and anything in between. It is easy to recite jargon such as healthcare, traffic security etc etc but in practice it is whole different issue.

 

 

quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Should not there be something to show for all those NGOs let loose or churchs initiated "awareness" projects, concomitant with the dilution of local norms and traditions?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

What are you suggesting? And what prove do you have for your fears?

The issue is precisely that firts part in italic, the admin should be forgiven "because Somalia is still more unstable in comparison to us".

 

Also, enforcing basic traffic security has been done elsewhere with little means; last time a relative of mine was victim of that neglect, others just had to fly in and watch him die as no airline accepted to carry him in that state (both the Dr and even oxygen bottles had to be dispatched from Djibouti; imagine the Djiboutian gvt pocketing the budget "because we have better stability in comparison to Somalia").

 

If Berbera tariffs are costing us in terms of productivity (even local traders may prefer Bossaso port), maybe a minimum of transparency in returns is not too much to ask for...

 

As for the NGOs, churches and other influences, it's not that hard to notice the acculturating effects in comparison to two decades earlier; our local Islamic and Somali identity should at least be preserved at home, if not actively promoted by the admin (who, interestingly enough, decreted Shariah in 2006), just as in every other country...

 

 

PS: Norfsky, thanks for your holistic analysis; many worry only about scoring imaginary points...

[ElPunto]

I think that Ngonge's analysis is mostly right. I do think that time is running out on Shiekh Sharif and his TFG. There is little to show for all the hype. I also think that the two northern entities are by default moving backward if they're not moving forward. That means elections and a handover of power in Sland and improved security and the return of LA for Pland.