Qac Qaac Posted December 29, 2003 khayr, if the girl got married, and she most definatel didn't want this to happen, then why shall i make it case against her... she never wanted to be raped, some ***** raped for no reason. so therefore to answer your question, yes i would definately marry her, coz is not like she had sex because he was her boyfriend, in this case she had no choice, and allah himself don't make a case against her and to the women who was raped she did zinaa, so therefore who am i, not to marry her. but this is only me. gir got raped, it happen bad thing to her, but she shouldn't change her life, and her daily routine for some sick person, and ppl shouldn't held this against her. p.s. but i would definately not marry a girl who had sex with out marriage, for free 4 anyreason to her boyfriend, or she made mistake as they say. raped ones are different from this category. xquizit ok. sis. whatever u say. didn't mean to make u mad Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abdulladiif Al-Fiqih Posted December 29, 2003 Kheyr, I think I was deceived by your name but anyway, the "Xeer" in the case of a rape is UN-ISLAMIC becasue its not in line with the shari'ah. In an case of rape, shari'ah rules that a rapist is to be punished with 100 lashes, if unmarried, or with death by stoning, if married, since this would then constitute adultery; NOT to give the hand of the victim in marriage to the RAPIST and condole his barbaric action. whom no one else will want to marry. Why so Kheyr? b/c she is not Virgin? I guess that is the main problem but guess what, its the somali culture(xeer is part of the culture) itself which sees it and made us believe that there is something wrong WITH non-virgin females----and we need to eradicate such elements of our culture asap and view such issues from Islamic point of view/perspective. In marriage, virginity is irrelevant and inmaterial but what guides it, is the character of the individual such as honesty and the likes. You better visit your sheikh akhi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
x_quizit Posted December 30, 2003 Xarbi, couldn't have said it better myself, it is excellent that you are educating the ignorants. Qaac, u have redeemed urself with the last post and Im glad u don't share Kheyr's narrow views. Kheyr, what if someone close to u, say a sister was raped, u'd tell her abuser to marry her and smile or perhaps ud tell other men in the communitee that she is not longer marriage material because someone took the liberty to violate her, an act that she did nothing to deserve. U are a prime example of the backward somali that deviates from islam and institutes their own traditions, such as blaming the victim or giving her to her abuser or placing a stigma on the victim. As xarbi suggested, a visit to ur local mosque is in sore need and a flash through to the qoran won't hurt as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Khayr Posted December 30, 2003 Salaamz, X-q and Xarbi Please don't try to chew meat if you don't have the teeth for it. In Shariah, if a muslim rapes a muslim, - he can be Stoned to Death, an exampe of this is recorded in the Sunan Abu Dawood hadith books. But a muslim is not to be killed for a nonmuslim. So if a muslim rapes a nonmuslim, he is not to be punished. - he can be given the punishment for zina and if married, well then that punishment is stoning to death. -There is also the ijtihad of the Ulama on this and an Alim can make an ijtihad/ruling to preserve the Name/Dignity of the Muslim Community, Dignity of the Muslim Families. Case in point is if a daughter got pregnant by her boyfriend, marrying them off right away so as to preserve the honor of the families (unless the man is a nonmuslim). Some of you might look at things from a certain angle and inshallah I see were you are coming from but I also see the Hikmah in what the somali elders used to do in these situations. Yes, it does sound harsh and unfair but realistically speaking once word gets around in a community that someone's daughter has been raped, most likely no one will want to marry that daughter or even any daughter from that family. Please don't knock the Somali Dhaqan just cause you got your quurba passport. You still Somali when applying for a job or in line for a loan at the bank. X-quizt, again you need a hugggg! Nomad sistahs, when u meet x-quizt, be sure to give her a hug for me cause she is definitely suffering from love, there's too much rage and anger in her. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
x_quizit Posted December 30, 2003 Kheyr, thxs for the hug, but id rather not get ebola virus..and its not anger baby boy, its called setting someone straight...u should thank me for trying to get the ignorance out of ur system.... Gals, whenever u run into kheyr, pls run the other way! cheers! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
African Posted December 30, 2003 Khyre I have few q’s 4 u brother; if a muslim rapes a nonmuslim, he is not to be punished. Can u give me the daliil? This sounds like Muslims who say it’s OK to steal from non-Muslims. Some of you might look at things from a certain angle and inshallah I see were you are coming from but I also see the Hikmah in what the somali elders used to do in these situations. For some1 who attempts to support his views through Islamic evidence you failed me in the above quote..….when every Prophet asked the people he was sent to guide why they worship the idols and not Allah they all responded with the same answer “we found our forefathers doing it”. Please don't knock the Somali Dhaqan just cause you got your quurba passport. You still Somali when applying for a job or in line for a loan at the bank. So in your view Somali Dhaqan is sacred like the Quran & Sunnah? I am Somali through and through, but Allah (SAW) asked me to stand 4 justice even if it’s against my own self……therefore I will not say right or wrong I’m with Somali Dhagan. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OG Moti Posted December 30, 2003 OK wait the minute.... here... first of all, let me talk about "Xeer" in the sense of Somalia and Yemen is full of $hit and unislamic, let me tell u this story... it happen in yemen while i was studying there... this girl comes to visit her friend, the friend was not in the house so the brother was there and asked her to come in, and raped her, then for Xeer or xaar "as i like to call it" reasons they gave the girl to her raper, and they got married, and since the day he married her, he beats her and beats the shit out her, and abuses her more and it was heart breaking to see her kicked infront of the people, and the worse thing was people do blame her for the rape and they say she deserve it to be treated that way and no one deos anything about it. She was double victimized by a Bahal who is far from being human... walahi u can not count how many times i wanted to kick the shit out him, but it wasnt my country and yemen people will group on me... ... so It is wrong to give the raped girl to her abuser.. it is unislamic, inhumane and what is wrong with a raped girl to marry who she wants, she was raped and it was not her fault, she is victimized and need support, personality i wouldnt mind to marry a rape victim cause it was not her fault and i would have tried my best to make her forget what painful experience she had by understanding her and sporting her.. that is one thing... so xeer somaliyeed is wrong and dont tell me waa dhaqan it is a bad dhaqan and it has to stop... Second whether the girl invited to be raped or not... i said many cases yes.... make ups and fleshy dresses are invitations to be raped... dancing and asking a guy to drink a coffee in the middle of the night is a serious invitation for rape... Questions to the sister who opposes my point of view... 1. Why do u make up any way? so that men will be admiring u? men will say Woooooooooooow?? excuse me u are inviting for rape... 2. why u have to invite a man in the middle of the night for a coffee? to talk? yeah right!! 3. Why do u dance sexxy? to be intouch with your soul? get out of here... u are trying to stimulate those with weak control and u enjoy seeing them suffering desires to u.. and when they have the chance they attack like a lion... so dont tell me no women deserve to be raped .. i know no body is deserved to be raped, i did not say they deserve ... i said they invited... and it doesnt make right but they could have avoided the pain if they avoid the above 3 questions..... a decently dressed women will not be subject for rape... and every theory has exceptions but decent dress is a protection.. .. Peace............. Rape is a social desease shared by women and men.. that is why our religion says a woman and a man should not be alone in one place, cause shaytan will be there and play a major role.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jaylaani Posted December 30, 2003 There is no difference between raping some one and killing some one. You literally have to be insane to commit such crime. I don’t believe the notion of women asking for it just because she looks and dress certain way. I think it is premeditated act. People like that must be institutionalized. I hate Rapists with passion. I can’t imagine what would I do if any one does anything like that to any of my dearest sisters. BTW, why would any one wants to rape some body when there are women everywhere who are willing to give it to you for free? You can even buy it if you are that desperate. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Khayr Posted December 30, 2003 if a muslim rapes a nonmuslim, he is not to be punished. The last part of the sentence was forgetton. My apologies, it was a typo. What I meant was that a muslim is not to be punished by DEATH, if they were to commit a crime against a nonmuslim b/c the life of a believer is sacred. Inshallah, I'll try to respond to your other q's walaal soon. Fi Amanallah Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faheema. Posted December 30, 2003 Originally posted by Khayr: If you knew a girl was RAPED would you marry her. Mostly likely I wouldn't and I know such information if found out would bring some shame. Subxaan allah, bal qofkaasi wuxuu ku hadlay eega? Brother, a RAPE victim does not have to dress/walk/behave or act a certian way. This woman could easily be your mother, your sister/cousin/auntie or even your wife, and believe me, no woman wants or chooses to go through such an ordeal. Markaa walalo virgin baad khalad ka fahantee, bal re-examine diin. Somali Culture and Islam does not always go hand in hand and some one said..... Originally posted by Xarbi: In marriage, virginity is irrelevant and inmaterial but what guides it, is the character of the individual such as honesty and the likes. You better visit your sheikh akhi Well put. Thank you Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Khayr Posted December 30, 2003 Salaamz, For some1 who attempts to support his views through Islamic evidence you failed me in the above quote..….when every Prophet asked the people he was sent to guide why they worship the idols and not Allah they all responded with the same answer “we found our forefathers doing it”. So correct me if I'm wrong here walaal but then if we don't follow what has come to us from the past, then how are we to determine what is right and wrong? Why is there the need for tradition and clans? Cause I never heard of anything in the DEEN making it HARAM to follow your cultural traditions. Exactly which part is HARAM about the 'XEER' law that suggests that the rapist pay money to the victim's family and get married to the victim. It might be cruel and sickening to some of us but I haven't seen a SINGLE NOMAD present a case for this to be HARAM. So in your view Somali Dhaqan is sacred like the Quran & Sunnah? I am Somali through and through, but Allah (SAW) asked me to stand 4 justice even if it’s against my own self……therefore I will not say right or wrong I’m with Somali Dhagan. -Somali Dhaqan has some of its roots in ISLAM. Why almost 100% of somalis are MUSLIM and many of them have their roots tied with Arabs. Do you think that a Somali who is not muslim can still be looked at as a 'SOMALI'? When compared to the modern day pop culture of 'the mass is right', I'd pick the Somali Dhaqan anyday. Now I never said that the Somali Dhaqan is anywhere near the Quran and Sunnah, so I don't know how you might have come to such a question, to which its answer you might already have reached at a conclusion. "I am Somali through and through, but Allah (SAW) asked me to stand 4 justice even if it’s against my own self" Mashallah, thats very admirable of you walaal. Oh one more thing, what punishment should be given to a rapist by the way? Fi Amanallah Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jaabir Posted December 30, 2003 Originally posted by Khayr: quote: if a muslim rapes a nonmuslim, he is not to be punished. The last part of the sentence was forgetton. My apologies, it was a typo. What I meant was that a muslim is not to be punished by DEATH, if they were to commit a crime against a nonmuslim b/c the life of a believer is sacred. Inshallah, I'll try to respond to your other q's walaal soon. Fi Amanallah we still need a Daleel from Sunnah brother Khayr... and if it was ijtihaad by some Culumaa.. then we'd still want to know who and how acredited they are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
x_quizit Posted December 31, 2003 OG, according to ur narrow views, if a woman wants to take care of herself physically, its an invitation to rape..so thxs for the heads up, i'll inform my sistas to stop showering so the "weak" man won't rape them... Basically ur logic is backwards and I shudder to think what u would do if someone close to u was raped, i bet ur first q would be, what were u wearing instead of who did this to u and what can i do to help u...u've lost me with ur ideologies and i hope more men don't think like u.. i guess u didnt read what i last posted except for makeup/dancing...but what u failed to pick up was that most girls who get raped are usually from ppl they know, their family, close family friends or their social circle..and its not someone who sees them in the street or at a dance club...so pls, why dont u do REAL research and stop spreading this lame idea to ur fellow men, some are extremely influential and if young men see ur views then they will think its ok to rape cause she 'asked' for it.. p.s.-i just want to see how many guys/girls believe that a woman asks for rape accoring to how she's dressed. etc....say "I"..if not say "nay"-OG this will be a new study and u will see how many support u/oppose u peace Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bilan Posted December 31, 2003 salaam i can not believe what i'm reading,there is no excuse at all for a rapist,no woman want to be raped, it's worst thing that can happen to anyone, and it does not affect only her, but also her family as well.khayr bro do not say that you'll never marry her because she was raped, it was not her fault, it can happen your sis or daughter then i'm sure you would not want her to be punished for something that was out of her control,and somali culture has little do with the religion, most of somali culture are based on unislamic laws and rules, and i do not think we should follow our culture if it goes against islam. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Khayr Posted December 31, 2003 Salaamz, Here is the Daleel 'The Believer shall not be killed because of killing a Kafir.' Sahih Bukhari & Muslim Now the rule extends to such things as a Muslim stealing from a kafir (by the way this rule applies to Ahl Al Kitabies) to raping a nonmuslim etc. I hope inshallah that this is sufficient proof. By the way, what I am saying about a particular topic, I try to take my emotions and personal preferences about it as much as possible. So I'm trying to share with you some of you nomads that the world can be viewed from many different angles, inshallah and to appreciate the DEEN, I think that this is necessary. Fi Amanallah Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
