It's like singing to the deaf.... :confused:

Much to the chagrin of the Puntland crew on this Forum, the truth speaks much louder than the propaganda. The difference in the weight each entity is awarded couldn't be clearer than the most recent visit to Ethiopia and who the respective leaders held working meetings with. Below I post for you the official Ethiopian media reports on the respective visits. Ethiopia: Federal police boss, Puntland president discuss human trafficking 214 words 13 March 2009 02:21 PM BBC Monitoring Africa English © 2009 The British Broadcasting Corporation. All Rights Reserved. No material may be reproduced except with the express permission of The British Broadcasting Corporation. Text of report by state-owned Ethiopian TV on 13 March Ethiopia has affirmed its readiness to work with Puntland Administration [northeastern Somalia] to curb illegal human trafficking. The director general of federal police held talks with Puntland president, Abdirahman Muhammad Mahmud. Fekreyesus Tewelde has the details. [Fekreyesus] Mr Workeneh Gebeyehu, director general of federal police, and Puntland's president, Mr Abdirahman Muhammad, talks mainly focused on how to control and combat the illegal human trafficking from Ethiopia to the Arab peninsula through Puntland. Mr Workeneh and the president discussed how both countries could work hand in hand in combating the crime by using the media to educate the society. They have also discussed how to bring to book those who are involved in the illegal activity. Mr Workeneh said that they have also discussed on how both countries could jointly combat any security threat to both countries be it crime or terrorism. He said that they have also discussed on how both countries can help each other on capacity building. Mr Abdirahman Muhammad on his part said that they can save the loss of human lives by combating the crime together. Source: Ethiopian TV, Addis Ababa, in Amharic 1700 gmt 13 Mar 09 ------------------------------- So basically, the meeting was about human-trafficking , an international crime whose regional crime-lords have found a ready base on the shores of Puntland. Meanwhile, another visit was taking place in Addis during the same time... Ethiopian premier in talks with Somaliland president 102 words 13 March 2009 01:44 PM BBC Monitoring Africa English © 2009 The British Broadcasting Corporation. All Rights Reserved. No material may be reproduced except with the express permission of The British Broadcasting Corporation. Text of report by state-owned Ethiopian TV on 13 March Prime Minister Meles Zenawi today in his office received and held talks with Somaliland president, Dahir Riyale Kahin. President Kahin while briefing journalists said that his talks with the prime minister had centred on the current security situation in the Horn of Africa and trade between the two countries. The president said that his country and Ethiopia shares a lot on the Horn of Africa issues, Ethiopian News Agency noted. Source: Ethiopian TV, Addis Ababa, in Amharic 1700 gmt 13 Mar 09 ----------------------------- Rayaale, on the other hand, warrants an audience with the head guy. Kind of gives a sobering reality check to the constant propaganda we hear on this Forum.

The VOA debate was ill-informed in its premise in that it presupposes that the stumbling block to Somaliland recognition is based on the positions of other Somalis and Somali regions. Even the better informed in Arab states(as well as the larger international community) know the obstacles are regional powerful states who oppose it for their own national interests. Here's a quote from today's article from a reputable Dubai publication: Egypt has successfully lobbied the Arab League to block Somaliland’s recognition. Egypt is locked in a perpetual struggle with Ethiopia over Nile River water rights and sees a greater, united Somalia as a strong counterbalance to Ethiopia. Link Egypt happens to be one of several states in the wider African, Arab, and European world that holds this anti-Somaliland position. However, there are others in those arenas that are more amenable to the Somaliland case. However, the non-Somaliland Somalis are quite irrelevant (I mean no disrespect, just simply stating the current geopolitics) to the debate since they're viewed as pawns in the greater game with no control of their own regions as present circumstances display let alone able to affect what happens in other regions/regional politics. Hence, African Union/United Nations mandates to place more peacekeepers, Ethiopian incursions into sovereign Somali soil, national navies patrolling of Puntland's shores, French commando missions within Puntland to grab pirates are all exercised without consultations with the rest of Somalis (outside of Somaliland). This is the real work that's cut out for the Somaliland administration (lining up enough regional support from non-Somali states). So the point is moot, my dear lads...

Ooda, You're giving way too much free tutoring :eek: You should have let them figure out the situation on their own. It would have taken a while... Che is not a bad character at all from his writings but happens to be frustrated most times with having such rascals for neighbors in his home region. Granting residency for him & his in Hargeisa will help him see the light

An interesting attempt by Dukey to start a Kulmiye/Udub flame war on SOL to distract from the losses of the last three years (for the "Yey cheerleaders" as they've been labeled on this forum). So far, no takers on the Somaliland side. I guess everyone sees the curve ball before it's even thrown

Ooh,the big, bad Somaliland... Coming to a neighborhood near YOU!!!

Very amusing article. Even those who reject Somaliland's aspirations will find it hard to take this article seriously. If you oppose Somaliland, bring a compelling debate to the table not the ramblings of a madman. The title of Professor or Doctor has become so cheap among some quarters. I've believed for a long time that the so-called Professor does not exist and is simply a pseudonym for another angry, frustrated Somali Qurbaawi. Whether he exists or not, it's hard to take him seriously given his writing style of vitriol and personal attacks (straight from the high of the Mafrish).

Duke, A nice side-step of the issue at hand, as usual May I comment on your removal of your quote "First they laugh at you, ... and then finally you win - TFG" immediately after the removal of Col. Yusuf. On second thought, I will leave it alone

Twisted Logic, Please give a break to the many Puntlanders on this Forum who've had a very tough past 18 months. They've been militarily vanquished by Somaliland on the West, politically vanquished by Nur Adde/Ahmed Abdisalam/Nur Adde on the South side, and now have finally been outmaneuvered by Ismail Omer Geelle with his selection of their new parliament/Prime Minister. The world has gotten used to absolutist statements from Puntland leaders that are never the truth and quickly contradicted by the same Puntland leadership. "We will free Las Anod in one week with all our military might and I, as the President, have even worn my military fatigues in preparation for battle". "Reconciliation between Nur Adde and Sheikh Sharif is just a sub-clan conference which we don't accept as legitimate and besides Nur Adde has been fired as Prime Minister" These are just some of the daily statements that come from that side of the woods which cover the recent humiliations the political leadership of that region has had to endure, hence the unceremonious sacking of Adde Muse (who was painted as the scapegoat for all of Puntland's problems). Unfortunately, for the average Puntlander, the elites of Puntland never cared about that region, seeing it as economically barren (that's why you don't hear of the fabulous oil deals/mirage from that corner these days) and have used it just as a bargaining position to get back to the good life back in 'Xamar-Cadde'. But what to do about those troublesome current Mogadishu residents who keep the good Puntlanders from returning to their lavish seaside villas in Mogadishu?! That's the billion dollar question that eludes this elite. So get used to the endless propaganda that's as far removed from reality as possible as well as the personal attacks which are used to cover up debates of ideas! It's all part of this Forum. Once in a while, though a genuine jewel of an idea or information comes out of this Forum, sometimes it even comes from a Puntlander

While reluctant to get involved in a spat between two cousins, honesty and fairness demands a fair assessment. I see Twisted Logic's point which Duke so far hasn't answered - Today, Abdullahi Yusuf is in exile while Ahmed Abdisalam is in Xamar. However, Ahmed Abdisalam/Nur Adde's faction seems to be have been sidelined by the new incarnation of Arta (hand-picked by Ismail Omer Geelle).

^^^ Like the Arabs? Split into over 20 sovereign states??

^^^ Like the Arabs? Split into over 20 sovereign states??

How's this any different than the official stance of Somaliland for the last 18 years - a future relationship between sisterly states and a common people? Such examples in the developed world are Germany and Austria; U.S. and Canada; etc. In the developing world, the Gulf Cooperation Council of the Persion Gulf; Rwanda and Burundi; etc., are some examples of this type of relationship between sovereign states.

^^^Bal nooga warama Africa Oil, Range Resources iyo Saliidii Shuukhyo idinka dhigeysey ; Rayaale iyo Siilaanyo ha inoo dambeeyaane

^^^Kuma rabto, saaxiib, kuma rabto

The fact that it came from Eritrea originally via Galgaduud implies an Al-Shabaab/Islamic Courts-Dahir Aweys connection. These portable anti-aircraft weapons were meant to bring down a passenger airliner probably during the election season since these groups always target Somaliland during election season. Overall a great danger was averted for now but these groups remain the greatest danger to Somaliland for the last 5 years. Imagine the amount of Somali mothers and children that would have died inside airplanes whether the plane was heading to Djibouti, Bossasso, Mogadishu, or Kismayo since a lot of Somali airlines use Somaliland as a transit hub. The cruelty of these fake Islamists never ceases to amaze. The question that begs to be asked is: Why is Somaliland such a threat to Al-Shabaab and related groups?

Somali piracy 'reduces tuna haul' Piracy off Somalia's coast is a cause of falls in tuna catches in the Indian Ocean - one of the world's richest sources of the fish, experts say. The head of the Indian Ocean Tuna Commission, Alejandro Anganuzzi, said catches fell by about 30% last year, seriously affecting the industry. The Seychelles economy has been badly hit as many foreign fishing fleets are based there. The reduced supply because of piracy has also driven up the price of tuna. Ship seizures The Indian Ocean tuna industry is said to be worth up to $6bn. Last year Somali pirates took 42 commercial ships with crews hostage, according to the International Maritime Bureau, including the biggest oil supertanker ever captured. A number of countries began naval patrols off East Africa and in the Gulf of Aden to try to combat the attacks. With the threat still present, fishing fleets have had to move further east from the Somali coast, Mr Anganuzzi told Reuters news agency. About 40% of Seychelles's foreign earnings come from tuna and related industries, the IOTC said. French and Spanish fleets based in Seychelles caught only 50% of their expected catch. The fleets usually catch nearly two-thirds of the year's haul off Somalia between August and November, he said. Seychelles is paid per tonne of fish landed for port facilities and reduced catches mean fewer calls to port. "The pirates' biggest impact, however, is reduced supply, driving prices up," the head of the Seychelles Fisheries Authority, Rondolph Payet, told Reuters. Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/africa/78451 73.stm Published: 2009/01/22 15:18:02 GMT © BBC MMIX

Question: Why is it that those who oppose Somaliland (pray daily for its destruction) openly advocate for Silaanyo & Kulmiye to win the elections in Somaliland? This was the case in the last Presidential elections where Abdullahi Yusuf as the leader of Puntland openly endorsed Silaanyo on the BBC. The same pattern is manifested in the current upcoming election. Just a question for all those concerned about Somaliland elections.

Inside a pirate network HARGEISA, 13 January 2009 (IRIN) - Hassan* and Mohamed* were fishermen in Bossaso, in the self-declared autonomous region of Puntland, northeastern Somalia, but turned to piracy out of desperation and lack of alternative livelihoods. However, in August 2008, coastguards from the self-declared republic of Somaliland arrested them after they strayed into the region's waters. In September, they were each sentenced to 15 years in prison for their role in the piracy that has intensified off Somalia's waters in recent years. Hassan and several others jailed on piracy charges spoke to IRIN between August and December from two prisons in Somaliland. Hassan said: "I participated in two missions which we planned in Bossaso; the first in February [2008]. As part of a group of eight, we went to Ras Azayr area in Puntland in search of some foreign vessels. We did not find anything. We thought that since there were no foreign vessels operating in Puntland waters, we could go to Somaliland. "I met up with a group of five men in Berbera and we agreed to operate in Somaliland waters. Unfortunately, Somaliland coastal guards captured us before we could do anything. I was later charged with organising piracy activities in Somaliland. "I agreed to engage in piracy because we wanted to get back at the illegal foreign vessels that were fishing in our waters, denying us a livelihood. We targeted foreign cargo vessels for that reason." Explaining how a pirate network works, Mohamed, who was sentenced in December, said: "I was captured in [somaliland's] His District alongside four other men captured by coastguards on 13 December. I was sentenced to 20 years in prison. "I, as do most pirates, consider myself as having been performing the duties of a coastguard. We usually work in groups of seven to 10 people. Often, our missions are financed by individuals and businessmen who collect half of the ransoms paid. "Many people who opt to become pirates do so because authorities such as those in Puntland contribute to the degrading of the sea's environment by licensing foreign ships which use illegal fishing methods.” Omar*, another of the jailed pirates, added: "Piracy has become booming business in Puntland territories; we receive the fuel and logistics from local business people. For example, when a kidnapped vessel pays ransom, 50 percent of it is taken by the people who invested their money; the pirates only get 50 percent." The ransom they pay is somehow a punishment for their illegal activity in the Somali water, especially in the era without governmentIn turn, the business people also give a certain percentage of the ransom to the influential people in the host area of operations, Omar said. However, he was quick to point out that pirates did not attack any ship coming to Bossaso. "No one will attack any ship toward Bossaso because the local people who support the pirates will not agree to the hosting of those kidnapped in their area, so the ships coming to Bossaso are safe from piracy." The pirates consider the ransom they get to be retribution for the ships that fish illegally off Somali waters. "The ransom they pay is somehow a punishment for their illegal activity in the Somali water, especially in the era without government," one of the pirates said. *Not their real names

Twisted, This is getting a bit silly. Let me simplify it for you: I asked you from the beginning to prove a simple statement you made initially - Ethiopia using Berbera/Somaliland to import or transport armaments used in "massacres in the South". You quoted reports stating Ethiopian training and security cooperation for Somaliland security forces. But that wasn't my question to you - if you can't find proof, be man enough to say "I've heard this but have no proof that I can present currently". It's quite simple, actually. Or present the proof. I think it's obvious what your silent answer is even though you dance around to other peripherals that have very little to do with what we're discussing. I understand you oppose Somaliland and it's unilateral reclamation of its statehood and that's your Allah-given right. But that's not what we're discussing here. Ka Baxey...

Twisted, This is getting a bit silly. Let me simplify it for you: I asked you from the beginning to prove a simple statement you made initially - Ethiopia using Berbera/Somaliland to import or transport armaments used in "massacres in the South". You quoted reports stating Ethiopian training and security cooperation for Somaliland security forces. But that wasn't my question to you - if you can't find proof, be man enough to say "I've heard this but have no proof that I can present currently". It's quite simple, actually. Or present the proof. I think it's obvious what your silent answer is even though you dance around to other peripherals that have very little to do with what we're discussing. I understand you oppose Somaliland and it's unilateral reclamation of its statehood and that's your Allah-given right. But that's not what we're discussing here. Ka Baxey...

Twisted, This is getting a bit silly. Let me simplify it for you: I asked you from the beginning to prove a simple statement you made initially - Ethiopia using Berbera/Somaliland to import or transport armaments used in "massacres in the South". You quoted reports stating Ethiopian training and security cooperation for Somaliland security forces. But that wasn't my question to you - if you can't find proof, be man enough to say "I've heard this but have no proof that I can present currently". It's quite simple, actually. Or present the proof. I think it's obvious what your silent answer is even though you dance around to other peripherals that have very little to do with what we're discussing. I understand you oppose Somaliland and it's unilateral reclamation of its statehood and that's your Allah-given right. But that's not what we're discussing here. Ka Baxey...

Regarding the interesting debate between Xiin and Warancadde: Warancadde/Red Sea, wasn't Godane & Al-Shabaab behind the terrorist explosions in Hargeisa?? How do you reconcile your support for Somaliland with your even more ardent support for Al Shabaab? Just a bit confused by your position statements on this Forum. Xiin, do you think the various Islamist groups (groups demanding Sharia law for Somalia)can consolidate after Ethiopian withdrawal from Mogadishu and surrounding areas? Remember they were not fully integrated or united even in the 6 months before the Ethiopian invasion (they also were not in conflict, to be fair).

Regarding the interesting debate between Xiin and Warancadde: Warancadde/Red Sea, wasn't Godane & Al-Shabaab behind the terrorist explosions in Hargeisa?? How do you reconcile your support for Somaliland with your even more ardent support for Al Shabaab? Just a bit confused by your position statements on this Forum. Xiin, do you think the various Islamist groups (groups demanding Sharia law for Somalia)can consolidate after Ethiopian withdrawal from Mogadishu and surrounding areas? Remember they were not fully integrated or united even in the 6 months before the Ethiopian invasion (they also were not in conflict, to be fair).

Regarding the interesting debate between Xiin and Warancadde: Warancadde/Red Sea, wasn't Godane & Al-Shabaab behind the terrorist explosions in Hargeisa?? How do you reconcile your support for Somaliland with your even more ardent support for Al Shabaab? Just a bit confused by your position statements on this Forum. Xiin, do you think the various Islamist groups (groups demanding Sharia law for Somalia)can consolidate after Ethiopian withdrawal from Mogadishu and surrounding areas? Remember they were not fully integrated or united even in the 6 months before the Ethiopian invasion (they also were not in conflict, to be fair).