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MoonLight1

Breaking news: Egypt Coup d'état, Morsy overthrown.

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Guzel   

There is no difference between secularists and Islamists in Egypt, both sides believe in oppressing people through fear by using violence and manipulating religion to divide and rule. Morsy and Mubarak share the same political ideology, they do not believe in civilian rule. I wish Morsy was removed by the people without the interference of the army.

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Haatu   

Khayr;974162 wrote:
In actuality, the "blind and deaf islam" aka prayer islam, is what a lot of secular ulama preach from the minbar too.

Heck, Sisi has fatwas telling him that all ikhawanis are kuffar and can be killed.

Heh! Don't you know dictators can nowadays purchase a juicy fatwa from a willing pseudo-sheikh?

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Haatu   

Hobbesian_Brute;974658 wrote:
As a general rule, in islam the most extreme positions always prevail over accommodating ones. recent events bear out these clearly.

The ignorance! Do you know that this is just one opinion of the scholars when it comes to differences of opinion in fiqh? Did you know that another opinion is that the Muslim should follow the easier of the options due to Allah's saying "Allah wants ease for you, not hardship"? (or something along those lines, I can't remember where exactly the ayah is). Did yo also know that another opinion is that if the person is knowledgeable enough he/she should read the proofs presented and follow the one he feels to be the truth?

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Haatu;975111 wrote:
The ignorance! Do you know that this is just
one
opinion of the scholars when it comes to differences of opinion in fiqh?

I'm not following you here, explain bal.

 

Haatu;975111 wrote:
Did you know that another opinion is that the Muslim should follow the easier of the options due to Allah's saying "Allah wants ease for you, not hardship"? (or something along those lines, I can't remember where exactly the ayah is). Did you also know that another opinion is that if the person is knowledgeable enough he/she should read the proofs presented and follow the one he feels to be the truth?

Haatu, why have we not seen muslims acting on these wonderful saying then ?? show us even one instance, its easy to point to few anodyne texts in islam and say look this is what the religion orders, but real world application and history disproves this.

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Haatu;975111 wrote:
The ignorance! Do you know that this is just
one
opinion of the scholars when it comes to differences of opinion in fiqh? Did you know that another opinion is that the Muslim should follow the easier of the options due to Allah's saying "Allah wants ease for you, not hardship"? (or something along those lines, I can't remember where exactly the ayah is). Did yo also know that another opinion is that if the person is knowledgeable enough he/she should read the proofs presented and follow the one he feels to be the truth?

Saaxib, don't waste time with him. He made a statement on Islam with zero knowledge, and he tried to pass it off as facts.

 

The Prophet said "Dispel the hudud (punishments) with doubt", and in Islamic Shariah the Judge is always obliged to take a lenient position and forgive the offenders.

 

Hobbes opinions on Islam hold no weight, and shouldn't be addressed, since they're not even based on facts. Don't give him any legitimacy by responding to him at all. Save yourself the trouble. If he comes with good arguments, I'd be happy to read them

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Haatu   

Hobbesian_Brute;975177 wrote:
I'm not following you here, explain bal.

 

 

 

Haatu, why have we not seen muslims acting on these wonderful saying then ?? show us even one instance, its easy to point to few anodyne texts in islam and say look this is what the religion orders, but real world application and history disproves this.

Let me explain first. In Islam, the scholars are united on the core of the religion, the creed.There's no difference when it comes to tawhiid, pillars of Islam, pillars of eemaan and so on. However, when it comes to fiqh, there is differences of opinion due to different interpretations of the sources (Qur'an and Sunnah). Examples are how many takbiirs in the funeral prayer, should one cross his hands on his chest after rising from ruku' etc. The scholars differ on many of these issues due to us being humans and understanding things differently. Now this doesn't necessarily mean one opinion is right and the others are wrong, no. It could be the case that the prophet did all of them from time to time or he did one regularly and did the other every now and then. Or it could just be one opinion is wrong and the other is right. However, no one is in a position (unless the other opinion rests on shaky proofs i.e. weak hadeeths) to say with absolute certainty this is right and this is wrong.

 

So the issue arises, what opinion does the lay man who lacks fiqh knowledge follow? Even on this the scholars differ. Some say he follows the easiest option, some say he follows the hardest option, some say he follows the opinion of his scholar and so on and so forth.

 

As for this:

Haatu, why have we not seen muslims acting on these wonderful saying then ?? show us even one instance, its easy to point to few anodyne texts in islam and say look this is what the religion orders, but real world application and history disproves this.

Firstly we are talking about rules, not what the majority does. In Islam a person is not supposed to blindly follow the majority but they should follow the truth. Secondly, it is my belief that if were Muslims were to learn their religion and follow its principles properly, then all the problems we face today would not be there.

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