Tuujiye Posted April 12, 2004 D.A..sweety why you wanna start with me again? people y'all see that this girl wants to start a debate with me which she will end up loosing it... Sis I told before and I will tell you again me and you are not the same level or maybe we don't understand each other. I never get mad and I neva get personal but I know you do and you like to give me a bad name..so sis I will not start a debate with you because were are not at the same maturity level...sorey sweety but i'm sure your a good person that doesn't understand me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Qac Qaac Posted April 13, 2004 DA, r u spokes man for all the women.... ooops did i say spokes man, i meant spokes women as u might wanna hear it this way. DA, sis are you one of those women, who took the men out of the word women, and changed into womyn... let shaabella talk for herself, i don't think, she needs your help, as she is educated for herself... if someone needs to know or enquire about history is you, u should find out what is behind the idea behind emanicipation of women... they teach it in Ecology class if u bioligst, or take any socio classes ok... and yeah History.... i guess u wanna change history to herstory right... no honestly sis, is getting rediculous we know where u stand, so naga daa, sanka hanaga soo gel gelin marwalba... damn. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Senora Posted April 13, 2004 Haye Qac Qaac...she could tell you the same thing...just because you two dont have the same views...doesn't mean she should be censored....you know..i think the only time you can ever make a rational decision, is when you hear both sides of the story...and if you dont want to, then challenge the argument, but dont make it personal by suggesting that she should just withdraw from expressin herself because..."we know where u stand"...we know where u stand too...so how about you just stop telling us what you think?...itjust wouldnt be fair... anyways...I think underdog your just trying to say that a woman shouldn't put her career first when the option of marriage and children come to play..I agree...OR if she continues to be involved in her career, then she shouldnt neglect he roles as a wife and a mother when doing so..alright i agree with this too... but there is one problems here.....you will never understand a woman....The thing with you men is you guys think that the perfect "feminine" woman should only be motivated by love of husband and children....and that they wil be fullfilled once they accomplish this....its not like that...Bambina pointed this out " Do u guys think it's easy for women to stay at home all the time? Unlike you guys women are locked up in their homes running after kids , cooking and cleaning.If for u its cool to have a nice meal waitin for u when coming back from home ,for the woman it might have been a crazy day.A woman is not only a mum but a lady who needs to prove to herself and not to the world that she's capable of using other skills besides taking care of children and thats why she needs to work." Yes, women want to have a loving husband and care for their children...but we have other wants.....we want to own a business..we want to design clothes...we want to be computer engineers...we want to be a sports athlete..we want to work in the governemt... we want to be doctors/nurses/therapist/geographers....we want to ...make... a ..change...and this is a self-fulfillment being a wonderful mother and wife completes a part of me...but it's not the absolute...and you will never understand that...These women who dont have to have a job but continue to, do it because it makes them happy, it makes them feel better...yes it should be a second priority when it comes to family, but it would make us even happier if we could have a husband that respects this ambition to want to do what makes us happy...and tries to be a part of this ambition by helping us out with the house,and the caring for the kids...."love is expressed in actions and efforts" Why have we allowed feminists to stigmatize homemaking? Women would be more than happy to be homemakers if it received the recognition and appreciation that it deserves We would be even happier if men would accept the fact that self-fulfillment doesn't just get achieved once you are married and have children... you know..a lot of these women who were a part of this new feminist revolution didn't want to do away with men or children...we still want that...( and we can do it right) they just wanted to do away with the ideology that we are complete once we do this.. P.S. you know were talking about both ends of the spectrum here, but a lot of us put aside the woman who is involved in a career, and takes care of her husband and children as well....the double-shift...and these women have existed just as long as feminism has, but we rarely give them credit..these to me are the strongest of them all.. I am a femine woman...who will love her husband, and take good care of her children...and will also do whatever else i can and want to make the world a better place...insha'allah Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
x_quizit Posted April 13, 2004 Ladies, I really don't understand why you have to justify yourselves to men who are obviously insecure about a strong motivated woman...let them talk all they want about the perfect "feminine"/passive woman which they really want, which is a fantasy, and don't let them make you feel any less of a woman because you choose to pursue education/career, instead of naively thinking that your husband will always be there for you to provide all your needs and your kids needs as well, which is totally unrealistic. For all you men insecure about a woman also bringing home the halal bacon, i say u should be happy that we're willing to share the burden of living in the west, expensive lifestyle that requires often both to work, regardless if one wants to stay at home or not, often its not a choice, its a need. In any case, let me pose u men a ques...if the woman was earning more than u, once the kids come into the picture, would you stay home? or do u still feel the need that only a mother can take care of her kids, even if ur making minimum wage and she's making substantially more? There are jobs were the employers will let the fathers take time off, from a minimum of 6 weeks to 3-6 months, as paternal leave, once their babies arrive, and most men do not take advantage of that, prefering the woman to stay home alone, and not seeing their role as a father to be classified as a stay at home dad. Instead of worrying about what a woman's role should be, how about u focus on ur male counterparts who are mostly irreponsible qaad chewing, coffeetime drinking bunch, who have put education/building a career secondary since they got welfare to support 'em. Like they say, people living in a glass houses shouldn't be throwing stones, meaning often men who don't have good education or good jobs are the first one to start pointing the finger at a woman, saying what's wrong with her, without first evaluating their SHORTcomings. p.s.-Majority of the somalis in the west, it is women who are the majority in universities, and the men are sadly behind, and maybe that's why this insecurity is shining through, because now they feel that they may not be needed therefore need to resort to anything to make sure the woman will always be dependent on them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
underdog Posted April 13, 2004 Originally posted by x_quizit: how about u focus on ur male counterparts who are mostly irreponsible qaad chewing, coffeetime drinking bunch, who have put education/building a career secondary since they got welfare to support 'em. Like they say, people living in a glass houses shouldn't be throwing stones, meaning often men who don't have good education or good jobs are the first one to start pointing the finger at a woman, saying what's wrong with her, without first evaluating their SHORTcomings. "Hell Hath No Fury Like A Woman Scorned". I'm no expert but you sound like you've been burned and might explain the bitter tone. You have a one track mind, sister, in your world men are the enemy. And I can't be bothered to reason with that poisoned logic. Peace be unto you, Sister. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
x_quizit Posted April 13, 2004 That's sad, if that's all the reply you can come up with, that just proves that u cannot counter my valid points, and if it makes u feel any better, go right ahead, cause some of us are made of thicker skin, and we don't let insecurities ruffle our feathers. p.s.-funny how men will always think a woman's view will be shaped by a man, trust me, our world does not revolve around u, as u so obviously wish. Sorry to burst ur ideal woman's bubble, and may the cave bless u with many mini-cave infants. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
- Femme - Posted April 13, 2004 The ideal man to mold yourselves under is the Prophet, scw. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
underdog Posted April 13, 2004 you will never understand a woman....The thing with you men is you guys think that the perfect "feminine" woman should only be motivated by love of husband and children....and that they wil be fullfilled once they accomplish this....its not like that...Bambina pointed this out " Do u guys think it's easy for women to stay at home all the time? Unlike you guys women are locked up in their homes running after kids , cooking and cleaning.If for u its cool to have a nice meal waitin for u when coming back from home ,for the woman it might have been a crazy day.A woman is not only a mum but a lady who needs to prove to herself and not to the world that she's capable of using other skills besides taking care of children and thats why she needs to work." Yes, women want to have a loving husband and care for their children...but we have other wants.....we want to own a business..we want to design clothes...we want to be computer engineers...we want to be a sports athlete..we want to work in the governemt... we want to be doctors/nurses/therapist/geographers....we want to ...make... a ..change...and this is a self-fulfillment P_S, I think we understand very well. I'm sure the same apply to men who work to support a family. There are some very important things to be considered here. Most of us are stuck in jobs that we don't like to make ends meets. It's very rare to find someone who is doing there dream job. The reason for that is priority. The career's you have in mind are not instantly achieved, they require a lot of time and a lot of committment. Specializing in any field means you sacrifice, it be the best you have to live and breath that career. P_S, do you think men don't want that presitge, that payoff at the end of it. BUT at what cost? Lets be real here, ladies and gentlemen. Help me calculate a timeline to success. Lets same both the man and the woman are 20yrs old and have goals of becoming either Doctors or Lawyers or Engineers etc. 1)How long does it take to develop a career? 2)While one chases that career goal, I guess the other one has to work to pay the bills, right? 3)Who goes first? 4)How long do you wait before you have kids? 5)If you have kids early how do you care for them? Help me out here? Some of you have answers...it's time to share. Show me how this works. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tuujiye Posted April 13, 2004 Maansha allaaaaaaaaah princess that was very nice sis...Finally A girl that said everything I was trying to articulate since this feminist crap started in here. Bravo sis. What you said is the truth and that’s the way I see things too walaahi. Now sexy there are girls in here which I will NOT name, who believe all woman should be = to men!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "Feminists" and sexy sis, I would like you to tell them why some men like their woman to stay home and do the house work while they go and make money? and why some men like to share the work with their wife? If their wives have some career to go after, they are more than happy to let her go and get her career? Ladies they’re many different men out their find the accurate one for you and guys they’re all kinds of women and I’m sure we could find the perfect one for us. So let’s not be astonished when y'all see a girl who doesn't see eye to eye with your views. Qac’qaac and underdog stop this topic because it always gets personal because some people have personal consideration about you two and ME. The more we share our views, the more that some people will be negative toward the topic. When a person is totally against your views from the first day, they will never give any chance to your second post because they won’t see it positive and your message will not go thru them. So lets stop this competition crap and get a life y’all. Somalideena waan isla wada sax sanahay. Each and every one of us think our view is the right way and that’s why we will never have a government because simply look at us..lol.. OO well hadal badan haan ma buuxsho aa ladhahay koow dhaha, marka ilaahey hadal keena maraq iyo muufo hanugu siiyo aamina dhaha… Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reality Check Posted April 13, 2004 Garab, You got it twisted brother. I dont want to be equal to men. Why would I want to aim that low Stop complaining about how we are not in the same level and start proving WHY we're not. You keep going around the issues (is it safe to assume that you really do not have a POINT?) I am curious, though, about the surge of women-bashing on SOL? Are some men on here threatened that most of the sisters (if not ALL) are well educated and assertive in their mannerism? This needs to stop. Women do not want to be just like men....they want to do what they are allowed in the eyes of GOD, not in the eyes of MAN. Qac Qac, Actually, its spokesperson Underdog, Why dont you find yourself a nice respectable girl who fits your standards. Good luck while your at it, because in this day and age, women want to make their own decisions and not live under the rule of a man. There is no sense in being frustrated at how successful women are becoming, really! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
underdog Posted April 13, 2004 No book has yet been written in praise of a woman who let her husband and children starve or suffer while she invented even the most useful things, or wrote books, or expressed herself in art, or evolved philosophic systems. Anna Garlin Spencer: Woman's Share in Social Culture, 1912 DA, I'm sorry you feel bashed, that's not my intention. and I'm disappointed that you think I'm frustrated by your success and I'm trying to hold you down. I'm trying to share ideas from my point of view. Why do you feel so threatened by that? I said in the first post of this topic that we shouldn't let this get to a shouting match where we all point fingers and no questions are answered. I have faith in my intellectual ability to support my arguments. Do you? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tuujiye Posted April 13, 2004 D.A lol...here we go again... Listen!! Learn the difference between strong and out spoken woman and feminist!! I'm sure you hear this lot from other male sol members. I am curious, though, about the surge of women-bashing on SOL? Are some men on here threatened that most of the sisters (if not ALL) are well educated and assertive in their mannerism? This needs to stop. Women do not want to be just like men....they want to do what they are allowed in the eyes of GOD, not in the eyes of MAN. Go out on sol and look for any post that I made were I denied the right of woman. D.A....again dear you talk but I never seem to understand you sis. I question if you read anything that I write or Underdog writes or qac'qac writes people that you challenge the most. You need to be confidence about yourself and stop defending your self all the time. And next time speak for your self because other girls in here don't distribute your views... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reality Check Posted April 13, 2004 Underdog, Brother, read my previous post again. I did not say "I", I said "Women". And no I am not threatened. But you need stop generalizing and critizing the Somali women who are trying to achieve something in this life. It feels like you want women to be homemakers only. At least that's what it comes off from your posting. If that's not what you meant at all, then I apologize. really! Garab, lol@confidence. You are too funny sometimes! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Senora Posted April 13, 2004 Most of us are stuck in jobs that we don't like to make ends meets....The reason for that is priority I know and we covered this area......were not talking about: 1)a woman whose husband past/divorced/or is a deadbeat..... 2)a woman who has to work alongside her husband to make enough for the family.. --or anything else that falls along these lines My perception was(and thats what i discussed in my previous post) that we were talking of the women who already have husbands that can provide for them w/o her having to work rare to find someone who is doing there dream job YEAH...but life doesn't come with everything you want....( if it did, then we would have no complaints)women aren't always just going after the job just because it's their dream job.... 1.the vacation you men know what im talking about...work can stress you out right...and it just feels great to come home right?...well its like the opposite for women...its fulfillment enough just being away from the house ....{cause we all know we get that...its stressfull being a house wife..and just getting away..havin a project outside the house relieves that} 2.Socialization you guys remember those times during primary and secondary school...where u didn't just go to schoolto learn..but to see your friends?..I know I had that...my mom is an example of this...she loves her job only b/c of the people....women love this too...their job may be a b*t*h...but they cherish those lunch hrs where they get to talk to their co-workers about whatever...something they may not be able to get at home.. 3.their time to shine women posses more than just "the motherly and wifey" talent....we have an eye for fashion...we sure know how to use a screw driver,lol...you get what I mean... -->there are so many other factors for women wanting to have a career.. The career's you have in mind are not instantly achieved, they require a lot of time and a lot of committment. Specializing in any field means you sacrifice, it be the best you have to live and breath that career. This is where the compromising btw the husband and wife comes play....its up to them to see how this sort of scenario works out...i've said that priority wise,family comes first...its a problem if the career interferes with ur personal life....but its important to know that this isn't always a "given" with this sort of situation...there are men more than happy willing to work out something(help around,etc) so that his wife would be able to balance her career and family needs....and this isn'tsurprising considering that she would do the same for him any day.. Help me calculate a timeline to success. Lets same both the man and the woman are 20yrs old and have goals of becoming either Doctors or Lawyers or Engineers etc. Then they should aspire to whatever possible...if and when either one decides to start a family..then both should discuss it...weighin both the pros and cons and come up with a decision that is both rational and suits them both --->there isn't a notepad of notes on what to do,how to do it,and when.....we all have our own answers... 1)How long does it take to develop a career? i'm not sure howlong mines will take..however long it is written for me... 2)While one chases that career goal, I guess the other one has to work to pay the bills, right? if i have to sacrifice so that my husband pursues his career...then i will, ...and if he considers to work a little sumthin out so that i could...well then that would just be dandy 3)Who goes first? who knows...if allah says...we both might be able to....those ppl do exist you know? 4)How long do you wait before you have kids? i dunno who could even answer these questions...i have no idea when i will...hopefully,god willing..i would be able to as soon as possible 5)If you have kids early how do you care for them? just like how every other woman has cared for them.....its not like this sort of thing has never happened....women have done this for ages...and it wont stop just b/c we want more in life... Help me out here? I dont think u need help...like i said everyone has their own answers and sets their own goals....and u seem to have layed out what u want ages ago Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Senora Posted April 13, 2004 I would like you to tell them why some men like their woman to stay home and do the house work while they go and make money? and why some men like to share the work with their wife? If their wives have some career to go after, they are more than happy to let her go and get her career I dont know why they do that....i do know that they exist...but you already said it yourself.. they’re many different men out their find the accurate one for you and guys they’re all kinds of women and I’m sure we could find the perfect one for us. P.S. WAAD MAHADSANTAHAY Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
