Hence, we shall never have models and beauty queens to publicize the beauty of our women down the catwalks of Paris, New York and London. It may be worth to mention here that on the several occasions that the name Somali caught international media, other than civil wars and Black Hawk down, were associated with women. It was Iman, that Somali model, who made the name Somali synonymous with such exotic, unique and Cushitic beauty. Somebody needs to get their priorities right. This is just another 'educated' chap who adores western decadence trying to use the three dead foreigners to champion his own silly agenda.

New-nation i don't know what is so funny about ordinery people, like lady mentioned in the artical, who are desprately trying to bring thier country and people in peace. How can you not see the funny side of this sort of baviour taking place at a peace conference?: One faction leader got into a fist-fight with a civil society delegate and some of his supporters beat up another delegate with a lead pipe. Thats a member of a civil soceity allright, but not as we know 'em. Here is another piece which made me chuckle. Somaliland Kings Heading Towards Mogadiscio With Love & Peace

^^^^^ Horn is it my eyes or does that quote say one of the clans originally from Somaliland? If what the reporter says is true that is.. If Jaama Yare and the likes of him can be expelled, why should the authorities hesitate doing the same to anyone else who they think is working against the interets of the Republic?

'' It's fine for soceity to be open about sex, but these days it's gone too far'' How do I answer this one when I disagree with the first bit and agree with the rest? Maybe thats why I came bang in between Mandela and Saddam

Miskiin macruuf The founders of SYL, the fathers of Soomaalinimo, the Aabiyaashii Ummada Soomaaliyeed meel walba ay joogaan. As much as I agree with SYL's fight against colonialist, I believe that they and their SNL counterpart were the first generation of Somalis who were 'educated' and chose western education and government systems over Islamic ones. The decisions taken by the 'Aabiyaashii Ummada' when they first took power were major mistakes worth learning from and not repeated. Rather than being heroes, some of these 'founding fathers' played a major role and could be considered the source of the disaster Somalis are in at the moment. They were incharge of the first colapsed government and their disputes with one another lead to the 1969 coup. sayfulaah however the idea that siyaad did mislead the somali history is in absolute false,siyaad did not and could't mislead the history, I don't know what your source of history is but, there are many Somalis who's only source was Siad's books and propaganda. These individuals still believe that they were the victors in 1977, we are all homogenous, Ahmed 'Gurey' was Somali and Sayid was a saint- when the truth might be different.

Nicely put Mobb, it maybe some people don't know how important the Sunnah is. The Qur'an tells us to pray, the Sunna shows us how and when to pray. The same applies to all the pillars of Islam and I don't know why anyone should think the Hijaab is different. The Qur'aan says cover-up, and the Sunnah teaches how to wear it (i.e wether to cover the hair or not). If we all agree that the Qur'aan says women should wear a 'veil', I think what we need is for the people with more knowledge about Islam to tell us how it should be worn, i.e the Sunnah. Thats how I understand it and I am not a real Sheikh so please correct me if am wrong .

Spoils of war US plans to sell off Iraqi businesses are simply the modern equivalent of pillage, says Brian Whitaker Monday October 13, 2003 For centuries, pillage by invading armies was a normal part of warfare: a way in which to reward badly-paid or unpaid troops for risking their lives in battle. Nowadays, at least in more civilised countries, we do not let armies rampage for booty. We leave the pillaging to men in suits, and we don't call it pillaging any more. We call it economic development. Today, the men in suits are gathering at Olympia, in London, for a two-day conference and exhibition entitled Doing Business in Iraq. Protesters will be gathering outside. The event, which is sponsored by the US-Iraq business council, is one of a series being held in different parts of the world over the coming 12 months (another will take place in Moscow in December), culminating in a grand spoils of war exhibition in Baghdad towards the end of next year. According to the organisers, speakers at the London conference will include several US government officials as well as a representative from Trade Partners UK, the British government's export promotion department. This fits in neatly with plans announced in June by Paul Bremer, the head of Iraq's provisional authority, to sell off the country's state-owned industries (excluding, for the time being, oil, gas and minerals) and turn it into a US-style capitalist wonderland. Last month, Mr Bremer issued CPA order number 39, giving foreign investors unrestricted rights to establish businesses in Iraq and/or buy up Iraqi companies. The order also allows foreign investors to repatriate profits, dividends, interest and royalties immediately and in full. In other words, they can make a fast buck if they want to, without putting anything back. While few would disagree that Iraq's industry needs modernisation and restructuring, two questions arise: has Mr Bremer the legal powers to do this, and is he going about it in the right way? He has already acknowledged that his plans will create large-scale unemployment, at least in the short term. His earlier decision to disband the Iraqi army exacerbated the country's fragile security situation by leaving several hundred thousand disgruntled ex-soldiers with nothing better to do than cause trouble. That is now widely regarded as a major blunder, and Mr Bremer now seems intent on repeating the exercise with the civilian population. According to the UN, the current level of unemployment in Iraq is around 50-60%: the last thing the country needs is more job losses. Mr Bremer shows little interest in drawing lessons from the problems caused by economic "shock therapy" reforms in the former Soviet Union, and in Iraq - with the added factor of military occupation - this can only fuel hostility towards the US. His order number 39 is also, almost certainly, illegal. The Hague regulations of 1907 spell out the obligations of an occupying power under international law. Article 43 says that, when occupying forces take over a country, they must "ensure, as far as possible, public order and safety, while respecting, unless absolutely prevented, the laws in force in the country". This means that Mr Bremer is not allowed to change Iraq's existing laws, including those that govern investment, unless it is "absolutely" essential to do so. Article 55 says that an occupying power is only the "administrator and usufructuary" of state property. "It must safeguard the capital of these properties, and administer them in accordance with the rules of usufruct," it adds. Mr Bremer, therefore, appears to have no right to sell off nationalised industries. In the House of Lords last week, Baroness Williams of Crosby tried to ascertain the British government's view of Mr Bremer's approach. She asked whether the government "regard current policies in Iraq to be consistent with the legal advice the prime minister received from the attorney general". She received the unilluminating reply that "it has been the practice of successive governments not to publish advice from the attorney general". Fortunately, however, we already have a good idea of what the attorney general, Lord Goldsmith, thinks about the matter. A memo that he wrote to the prime minister, Tony Blair, on March 26, a week after the invasion of Iraq began, was leaked to the press some time ago. "My view," the attorney general wrote, "is that a further security council resolution is needed to authorise imposing reform and restructuring of Iraq and its government. "In the absence of a further resolution, the UK (and US) would be bound by the provisions of international law governing belligerent occupation, notably the fourth Geneva gonvention and the 1907 Hague regulations." He went on to note that the Hague regulations impose an obligation to respect the laws in force in the occupied territory "unless absolutely prevented". "Thus, while some changes to the legislative and administrative structures of Iraq may be permissible if they are necessary for security or public order reasons, or in order to further humanitarian objectives," he said, "more wide-ranging reforms of governmental and administrative structures would not be lawful." The restrictions imposed by the Hague regulations, as the attorney general suggested, can only be over-ridden by a UN security council resolution. Interestingly, the preamble of Mr Bremer's Order No 39 claims just such backing. It states that the order is "consistent" with security council resolution 1483, approved last May, which lifted sanctions against Iraq. But although the resolution talks vaguely (in paragraph 8e) about "promoting economic reconstruction and the conditions for sustainable development", there is nothing in it that can sensibly be construed as giving Mr Bremer permission to make sweeping changes to the investment law. Indeed, paragraph five calls upon "all concerned to comply fully" with the Hague Regulations. The legality - or otherwise - of Mr Bremer's order is unlikely to trouble the Bush administration, although future US administrations may have to grapple with the consequences arising from it. The prevailing view in Washington was set out with astonishing bluntness four years ago by John Bolton, now chief hawk at the state department, when he said: "It is a big mistake for us to grant any validity to international law, even when it may seem in our short-term interest to do so - because, over the long term, the goal of those who think that international law really means anything are those who want to constrict the US." Whether the British government, which tends to be more squeamish about such matters, agrees with this is still unclear, though the presence of its official from Trade Partners UK at the investment conference in London suggests that it does. The US, however, has made no bones about its intentions, regardless of what the Hague regulations say, to make as many structural changes as possible in Iraq while it has the chance. Its hope, of course, is that these will have gone too far to be undone once a proper Iraqi government takes over. On the other hand, the changes may go so far that a future Iraqi government feels obliged to overturn them in order to establish its popular credentials. In that case, the invasion - with its phoney goals of removing Saddam Hussein and disarming him of weapons that he didn't possess - may be just a prelude to the real battle for Iraq yet to come. Email brian.whitaker@guardian.co.uk web page

Gediid So please stop misleading people with false made up stories you pick up from Allpuntland.com...... All I can say is you believe Smith and Co you believe anything. My favourites bits must be the dodgy 'intelligence' included: Culminating this newly formed alliance is Somalia's reenergized al-Itihad al-Islamiya - A/Qassim Salat Hassan's ARTA supporters and financiers. Chief among them are known individuals suspected of sustaining close ties with Middle East terror organizations, also included are al-Qaeda's Horn operators and some 'most wanted men I can't tell wether this is kissing Ucle Sam's backside or making excuses for the hoodlums gathered in Kenya over the last year or so. Who are they going to blame next?

^^^^^^Chicken

SmithNwestern Hold up, I have never excused the excesses of anyone least of all Abdullahi Yusf Ahmed. SmithNwestern Has the quality not to miss use funds provided by the donor nations Somalia calls out for one man and that man is Abdullahi Yusuf Ahmed Smith I think you owe us an explaination son, are you saying Abdillahi Yusuf is a murderer but because he is such good accountant he deserves to be a leader of a nation?

Lateafha One of the reason I decided to stop coming to S.O.L is because of some people's unIslamic ways. I am think i should be careful what i read with my eyes willingly because i'll be judged for it on the judgementday. Lateafha I not sure if you are going to read or reply to this but it would be nice to know what you mean by 'people's unIslamic ways. I would aslo like to know how you deal with newspapers, tv, and other things we take for granted as being harmless. Khayr I think that SOL has probably the best discussions with respect Islam, Somalis, Arts, Technology etc. That maybe the case, but would you let a young person read all that is posted at SOL? I certainly would not encourage my nieces and nephews to read what is sometimes posted and discussed in here. Since the Admins have decided to create a 'teens' section I think the should not allow things that are against our culture and religion to be posted in here. I think this place should not be used to 'westernise' young people and lets all remember some things are ' CEEB '.

Bee the 'gentleman' would talk about anything but the evils of the most corrupt group of individuals he calls 'the dream team'. I don't think this attempt to silence the people who say things he wants swept under the carpet is going to work.

A Delicate Balance As Somali Clan Lords Dominate Talks The Nation (Nairobi) September 29, 2003 Posted to the web September 29, 2003 Chege Mbitiru Nairobi Former US ambassador to Kenya, Smith Hempstone, once described Somalis as natural guerrillas. It wasn't quite clear why he poked his nose in Somali affairs. That was someone else's docket. Anyway, he rightly warned his president against embracing what he called "the Somali tar baby". Mr Hempstone was referring to classical guerrilla warfare. At the time the Somalis were doing just fine. They got much better when UN and US troops showed up. The lot left ignominiously. Guerrilla warfare continued. Casualties still add up. What Mr Hempstone and others missed, and still do, is that Somalis are also masters of another form of guerrilla warfare: verbal. The latest round of skirmishes is in Mbagathi, just outside the Kenyan capital, Nairobi. No faction has won yet. But then none has done so outright at home. The gathering is under the auspices of the Inter-Governmental Authority on Development (IGAD). The group's Eastern Africa member states have precious little cash. They depend on handouts from wealthy nations in Europe and the Americas. The purpose of the powwow is to find ways of establishing some order in southern Somalia. Presumably once this is accomplished northern Somalia, which now calls itself a republic and is reasonably stable, could be persuaded to rejoin their brothers and sisters, the Republic of Somalia will be reborn. Since the overthrow of dictator Mohammed Siad Barre 12 years ago, many nations have nearly choked in a bottomless pit of patience. They have listened to rounds of clan poetry recitals disguised as political and constitutional discourse. Each round has cost money. These nations have coughed it. It isn't that they love the colour of Somalis eyes. It's just too expensive to have 637,557 square kilometres of lawlessness. Moreover, the human race isn't bad, deep inside. Starving and sick people tap wells of tears and unbutton wallets. So do images of youngsters totting guns instead of reciting nursery rhymes. Last July there was a modest euphoria in Igad quarters. Somalis in Mbagathi had signed an accord considered "historic". The deal included a federal parliament that would name a president. The president would then appoint a prime minister. The euphoria was understandable. The round of talks, in its tenth month, is one of more than a dozen so far. Unfortunately, some sensible pronouncements from past talks vanished in volleys of gunfire and vitriolic verbiage. Some meetings had comical results. One in Djibouti produced a Transitional National Government. The president ended up with a few blocks of rubble in Mogadishu to govern. He still earned an invitation to the United Nations in New York. The Mbagathi accord didn't excite some strongmen back home. Mogadishu faction leader, Musa Sudi Yalahow, explained. The signatories lacked clout. Mr Yalahow took a leaf from Mr Barre. When Mr Barre seized power, he was the only police or army general from his Marehan clan. By the time he was ousted, the number was nearly a half of the 103. The Marehans were well-lubricated cogs in the general's dictatorial machine. It was disguised as socialism. Moreover, Mr Barre routinely manufactured hostile clans and turned the ones friendly to him against his perceived enemies. He manipulated the clans in order to remain in power. He turned Somali clans into what they never were: fighting machines. Somalis' allegiance to clan is legendary. There is nothing wrong with that. Belonging to a clan is a biological accident and an inevitable socialising and survival necessity, at least in origin. Traditionally, Somali clans didn't fight for the sake of it. They fought for something and then stopped. More than anyone else, Mr Barre demonstrated clan loyalty's manipulability. He had good students. The late Mohamed Aideed and businessman Ali Mahdi, for example, belonged to different clans. They manipulated them against the master. It wasn't difficult. Mr Barre's brutality made the manipulation even easier. When it came to sharing spoils, Mr Aideed and Mr Mahdi read Mr Barre's script, manipulated their clans for personal gains, reduced Mogadishu to rubble and enlarged cemeteries. Early this month, five prominent faction leaders, including Mr Yalahow, met in Mogadishu. The purpose, they said, was to salvage Mbagathi talks. The message was clear. Those with clout on the ground call the shots. Now Igad is stuck with the "tar baby". Mr Barre is dead, but the baby's guardians are known. They've got clout. It's time Igad told them to negotiate seriously or take the baby, clans and all, and cuddle it at home. http://allafrica.com/stories/200309290078.html

Yusuf malitias usually attack to gain control of places and facilities from the other, side be it a village or an airport. So when they make their move, they don't care if they get it slightly wrong. As for how I tell who am dealing with, accent, choice of words and dress sense are major clues. Some say 'tomate' other say 'tomande', 'botate', 'Barade' etc ect. How about Daasad, Qasac and Kombo, are you still with me? .

Ali both you and the 'doctor with no tools' are welcome to work and live in Somaliland. People from all sorts of background do live and work in Somaliland and I don't see why you two should be the exception. In fact that is what Somaliland is all about as far as am concerned. If the people who were part of the dead regime have been forgiven I don't see why should worry at all. What I am not so sure about is what sorts of rights you (a non Somalilander I think) will have. I hope someone helps us on that.

Samurai the honourable girls/ladies have tried t reason with you without much success and I was trying to remind you and the rest of the Somaliland bashers that it would be wiser to look at Abdilahi Yusuf administration, a subject you all love kept undiscussed before jumping on Somaliland. It seems you would rather get personal than defend or explain Abdillahi Yusuf's actions and record on the subject of corruption and finacial dealings, when are you going to 'stir sons and daughters' of Puntland I wonder?? . How do you explain changing the headline fron 'averts closure' to 'brink FOR closure' I wonder? . For the records, Somaliland's sons and daughters don't need encouraging to talk about the subject, just check the contributions we gave on the 'Budjet review' posted by comical Bari during the summer. Surprisingly, even when an issue of genuine concern has been raised you come running with your gobs wide open with preconceived notions of prejudice without a moment’s thought. Then, when your pleas had been noted, you go back running to the mud house tossing spoonful of dirt. And when challenged you tuck tail and disappear into the woods for weeks as though scolded for wrongdoing. Astonishingly bewildering! Mando, why don't you comment on this? Madaxwayne ku xigeenka Puntland oo gaashaanka ku dhuftay Xabsi gurigii Taliyaha Booliska Puntland - Thursday, September 11, 2003 at 11:18 Garoowe, (AllPuntland) - Madaxwayne ku xigeenka Puntland ahna ku simaha madaxwayanaha Puntland Md Maxamed Cabdi Xaashi ayaa gaashaanka ku dhuftay qoraal shalay ka soo baxay guddoomiyaha Maxkamadda Ciidamada Puntland oo xabsi guri iyo shaqo ka joojin ku xukuntay taliyaha ciidanka booliska Puntland. Qoraalka shalay ka soo baxay Maxkamadda Ciidamada waxaa ku saxiixnaa Guddoomiyaha Maxkamadda Cabdullaahi Jaamac Gayre, waxaana xabsi guriga iyo shaqo ka joojinta lagu sababeeyey xil gudasho xumo iyo dhaqaale lunsi. Hadaba, qaraalkan kale ee Maanta ka soo baxay Madaxtooyada ayaa lagu sheegay in aan sharciga loo cuskan shaqo ka joojinta iyo xabsi guriga taliyaha Booliska Puntland G/sare Xirsi Gaataa, sidaas darteedna aan madaxtooyadu aqbalin. Arintaan ayaa la rumaysan yahay inay salka ku hayso isla arimihii dhaliyay khilaafkii dib laga xaliyay ee dowladda madaxda ugu saraysa soo kala dhex galay bishii July, kaas oo ku saabsanaa isku badalkii wasiirada Maaliyadda iyo caafimaadka; Taas oo aakhirkii laga noqday. C. C. Farayaamo AllPuntland, Soomaaliya

Samurai how come we never saw you and the other Alltolka.com boy say a post or word about the judge who demanded Puntland's Police Chief be arrested for taking bribes? Why did I have to beg Alltolka.com boys who are so quick to jump on Somaliland to comment on the Puntland's Finance Minister accused and sacked by his Vice President of corruption and dodgy dealinigs? Both these men got away because your leader Abdillahi Yussuf the biggest crook of them all said so. Don't you think you have bigger FISH to fry in Bosaso's ports before you land at Egal Airport? BTW its almost a year and your leaders are still in a foreingn country talking utter rubish while the hoteliers are demanding they pay their bills and Mughdisho Airport is still closed. Bari Nomad, what planes land at Garowe International Airport?

On behalf of the Somali delegates attending the Somali National Reconciliation Conference and as representatives of the Somali people at large Calling them lot 'political leaders' is stretching it, but 'representatives of Somali people at large'? 3. Finally, we would like to point out to the international community that the statements made by Mr. Abdiqassim were made in his personal capacity and do not necessarily represent that of the Somali people since his term of office has officially ended on 12 August, 2003. 1. Abdullahi Yusuf Ahmed - President of Puntland 2. Hasan Abshir Farah - Prime Minister (TNG) If Mr Abdiqassim's term has officially ended, why is Hassan Abshir at number 2 on the list as Prime Minister(TNG)? :confused:

That is a lie!! No donkey is worth 4 grand!

guraad Please - Sign the Petition And Save Somalia. lol @ petition and save Somalia. Slowly but surely someone is starting to feel the heat. Guess what, I even know who will be issuing the passports of the new Republic, better send the photos citizen Guraad . Now you know why its so quiet on the top left corner. :cool:

Gediid thanks for that, I think the article below explains the thinking behind Bush's government and Texas oil business. The writer is clever enough to know when to stop... farewell america

Entre As you are aware Somalia's police and army have done much worse things to fellow Somalis than the Kenyans have to their ethnic Somalis. Although I support your call for self-determination, what are gaining from calling people 'adoons'?. Somalis in Kenya have have been allowed to reach much higher in every sector of society compared to Somalia's ethnic Bantus, do they have the right for self-determination? Originally posted by Hornafriqe: The various ethnicities of Kenya look alike, speak Bantu languages, and have similar pagan cultures. What about this Somali, Muslim, Cushite, with his mixed physical features? They have an inferiority complex when it comes to us, and they're trying to sate it by the treatment they give our people in their country. Somalis are not the the only Muslims in Kenya, the whole of the east coast is occupied by people who might not have your 'cushite' features but they are certainly not pagan.

You thought we wouldn't notice if you slid in few extra words from the original document, did you?

lol Samurai, I always wonder what you think of Oodweyne calling you 'pamphleteer' or 'Jack', do you see where he is coming from?

Here is a fantasy league football competition which starts on the 30th of August and free to enter. I see some of you talk a good game, lets see how good you really are. I'll post my team selection later (inshaAllah).