The treachery of the secessionists has no limits: Letter to Israel

[SOO MAAL]

First, people of northwest are Muslim Somali people like their fellow brethren Somalis

 

Therefore I am confident that no sane somali person whether he is from northwest/northcentral/ or south would even think about the possibility of Somali administration to have involvement with Israel, because that is a betrayal to Muslim ummah

 

Obviously, Egal letter is a fake, but the dangerous ideas that few individuals like Faysal Diriye in Ottawa, and Rashid Nur in USA are circulating is outrageous and offensive to Somali people, and muslims in general

 

Definitely, its unacceptable and intolerable for Israel to have diplomatic relations with any Somali administration, let alone having military bases in Somali soil whether its south west north or east

 

Red sea, your rational comments were the most healthy and constructive in this entire debate

 

Qudhac and Odweyne discuss in good manner like red sea, offensive words or name calling is not helping to put across your views

[KEYNAN22]

Soo maal:

Therefore I am confident that

no sane somali person

whether he is from northwest/northcentral/ or south would even think about the possibility of Somali administration to have involvement with Israel, because that is a

betrayal to Muslim ummah

Betrayal to the "muslim ummah"??

Speak for yourself, you'r belief of what's right or wrong is subjective and thus personal. Isreal is not an enemy of Somalia and has never shown any negative action against somalia.

So if you have sympathy and support of the palestinian cause rather than looking after your own garden(somali people), then please move to the palestinian-Israeli battle field. However we (non-wannabe)Somalis have our own battle which the outcome we value greater than what happens on another continent. Your type can just leave and please dont come back after you liberate the palestinians from the evil Israelis!

 

Protecting the "muslim ummah" against the evil Isrealis? This will ofcourse give voice and power to Palestians and hopefully after this "victory" Somali children might get raised into a better level automatically by protecting and supporting the "muslim ummah" right!? The palestinian victory against Jews will grant Somali children and their descendants a protected life, right?

 

Whats the use of consuming scarce resources provided by our earth on people like you, when your whole existance suffocates the great human mind and all great potential developments??

[Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar]

Maxee tahay afxumeyntaan iyo caayda soo noqnoqeyso? Dad waa weyn mar walba aflagaada laga celinaayo? War dadyahoow isku xishooda, sharafta ha iska qaadina, baliis.

 

Don't force us to edit caayda from your posts.

 

Wah.

[SOO MAAL]

Keynan22

 

First of course, I am speaking for my self and expressing my personal opinion as a concerned Somali, and of course I ma very subjective when it come to Israeli-Palestinian conflict, and Israeli’s involvement Somali-Ethiopian war in 1977 over the occupied western Somalia region. Israel is enemy of Muslim ummah including Palestine, Somalia, Sudan, etc Israel is an ally of Somalia’s historical enemy Ethiopia

 

I and huge majority of Somali people share the sentiment that Israel is enemy of all Muslims, go visit yourself Hergeysa, Burco, Laascaanood, Bosaaso, and Mogadisho and find out the views of Somali people regarding Isreal

 

Second, of course as Muslim I have all and infinite sympathy for my Palestinian brothers,

 

 

Third, all Muslims pray victory for their fellow Palestinian brothers over Israel in all mosques throughout the world during the Friday prayers, may Allah accept our du’a amiin

 

we (non-wannabe)Somalis have our own battle which the outcome we value greater than what happens on another continent.

Why you speaking for my fellow muslim somali brothers, I expect you to speak for yourself and stop hypocrisy

 

You telling not to speak for my somali people, while you acting as spokesperson for somali people

 

Please stick to what you preach

Whats the use of consuming scarce resources provided by our earth on people like you, when your whole existance suffocates the great human mind and all great potential developments??

Nonsense, doesn’t make sense, I just have say to you “Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something.†by the great philosopher Plato

 

We debating here, so you don’t need to resort a personal attack

 

Really some people in here need to learn how to debate

 

Please discuss with acceptable behavior, the purpose of this forum is to share the diverse and the different opinions, don’t attack individual who don’t share your views because that’s not the way to debate issues, talk about ideas, issues at hand not individuals like soo maal,

 

 

Somalia and Israel have a long history of hostility because Israeli’s major alliance with Somalia’s historical enemy Ethiopia

 

Therefore, learn the history of Somalia and get your facts straight then you will some thing to contribute to this thread or can formulate a rational opinion regarding any Israeli involvement in Somali territories

 

///////////////////////////////////////////

 

The EtAF was thus left alone at the time of increasing tensions with Somalia and the WSLF invasion. Reportedly, Mengistu’s regime initially contracted a number of Israelis to help support the US-made EtAF equipment. According to US and Israeli sources, a group of Israelis arrived in Ethiopia in early July 1977, and helped return a number of F-5As into working order. So it should have happened that on the morning of 16 July, two F-5As piloted by Israelis were on a "training combat air patrol near Harer" (citate from former USAF instructor who worked with Israelis in Ethiopia at the time), when a flight of four MiG-21MFs was detected nearby. The Israelis engaged immediately and the ensuing air combat was over before it really started. Two MiGs were shot down by Ethiopian fighters, and two others collided while trying to avoid an AIM-9B fired by F-5s.

 

Ethiopian sources deny any kind of Israeli involvement, instead insisting that the EtAF did everything alone – even in face of increasing Soviet and Cuban presence. During the final months before the WSLF invasion, namely, the four EtAF fighter-units launched a crash programme to bring as many F-5As, F-5Es and F-86s into operational condition. Ethiopian F-5E-pilots flew dissimilar air combat training sorties against F-5As and F-86s, which simulated MiG-21s and MiG-17s, respectively, and were well-prepared to face their opponents in air combat.

 

In the hands of Somali pilots the MiG-21MF proved no match for far better trained and more experienced Ethiopian and Israeli pilots. In fact, very early after the initial Somali attacks and invasion of O gaden the EtAF F-5s were operating offensivelly into the Somali airspace, flying "training sorties" even over the Hargheisa AB. It was during these "training sorties" that the Israeli pilots scored five confirmed kills against SAC MiG-21s, thus winning the air superiority battle of this war. (all artworks by Tom Cooper)

 

 

Somali advances

Map showing Somali advances in northern west somali and the counter-offensive by combined Cuban-Ethiopian forces under Gen. Petrov. (Map by Tom Cooper on basis of Encarta 2003)

 

Column of Cuban-manned Ethiopian tanks seen near Jijiga, in March 1978. (via Tom Cooper)

 

 

Source:

(Ethiopian-Somalia Conflict) 1977-1978

[me]

Well said SOOMAAL

 

Some people do not realize that.

[RedSea]

Originally posted by me:

Mr. Red Sea,

 

I appreciate you coming out against Qudac's remarks and condemning those 'intellects' from the secessionist camp that are writing this rubbish.

 

I am a Somali that is against the division of his country and his people; I do not appreciate you saying me being pro-unity is clan motivated, just as I wouldn't dare to say that clannism has made you a pro-secessionist..

 

You probably have better reasons then just clan

 

My brother Red Sea, I truly value your opinions and respect your position; however I do not seem to understand why a man of your intellect would support a cause that will lead us to more misery

 

I hope that one day we will be fighting side by side for a bigger cause, instead of being divided by these petty differences.

Assalamu calaykum,

 

My dear hometown boy ME and my brother in Somalism and most importantly in Islam.

 

As much as enjoy having discussions with you, I have to say you sometimes put words into my mouth. I am in no way think or saying that you are wrong to believe that we as Somalis should be united under one adminstration, infact I think that is very good if we could have. However, what I am against is calling unity while promoting other things with it.Such as posting fake articles, focusing primarily on one region and puting all the blame on them as though they are the only problem that we have. You didn't have to post a fake letter made to be written by Igal to get your point across. That letter isn't authentic and you should know that by know, but other articles regarding any relations between Isreal and Somaliland, I have to say time and again, there shouldn't be any relations between a Muslim region recognized or not and Isreal, the enemy of Allah, the enemy of ALL muslim people .This opinion is not only held by me, but I am confidently sure that 100% of the Somali people living in Somaliland are against having any relations with Isreal. Isreal is seen by all Muslims through the same lenses except few of us offcourse, they are seen as the pure enemy and threat to our faith and whatever we stand for. The latest news coming from Beirut, lebenon is just a prove as to why that is.

 

In addition, what was written by so called intellects from Somaliland shouldn't be taken as though their opinions underline the views of the actual population in Somaliland, they absolutely don't. That is the one area that I would like you to focus on little bit more, in trying to differeciate the people from the Politicians. Believe me when I say Riyale Kahin and Abdullahi Yusuf belong in the same league in my view. I think they are both two individuals with dark present and past that speaks for itself. They are not the type of people that I would want to be sided with as you have done by refering me as pro seccesionist, ultimately meaning pro A/raxman Tuur or pro Igal or pro Riyale Kahin for that matter which I am not. Riyale is a criminal and I am not, therefore why should I support his cause?

 

As you might have realized, I am a huge supporter of the Courts. The courts are in Muqdisho and I am from Hargeisa, so what does that tell you on where I stand? I am just waiting for the right leadership in order to consider myself pro unity. As long as people like Yeey are being elected, then I don't see the point of this whole unity thing.

 

If the courts can manage to take care the problems in the South, then I am happy to welcome them to our city Hargeisa. In fact I wouldn't mind having Shiekh Sharif Axmed as our leader in any day over criminal and the corrupt Dahir Riyale Kahin and his fellow corrupt Udub party cabinets.

 

 

Finally, in order to come across or for your opinions to come across very well you need to adress everyone and combat the comments made by those who are speaking for the interest of clan such as the supporters of A/Lahi Yusuf and others as well. That way, you will be seen as fair minded individual whose is standing up for what is right. If you can accomplish that, then count me on as your fellow fighter.

 

Assalamu calaykum.

[RedSea]

Qudhac's comments are in parenthesis for the better of our discusion.

 

"Israel is independant nation that has international relations with nearly every single country on this plannet, so what exacly is wrong with having deplomatic relationship with another nation."

 

I don't recognized Isreal as a State at all, how is that sound my friend? the land, I call Palestine. Or have you excepted the fact that Isreal was made to be after millions of Palestinians who resided in that land were forced into refugee camps just to make room for the "new" Isreali state. Damiir kugu ma jiro miyaa sxb?

 

"ask yourself this why do nearly 90% of arab states have nearly full deplomatic relationship with them, even those that make noises make trade deals with them bewhind close doors."

 

I don't care who supports Isreal and who isn't, what I care is whether we should support as a Muslim or not to which the answer is NO WAY JOSE should we have anything to do with Isreal in both diplomatic relationship or otherwise.

 

 

"you another typical somali who takes this arab yahuud conflict seriously, these people were killing each before even our prothet were was born."

 

throughout history, they have been the hard headed monsters on this earth that denied their Lord even after they were rescued from Pharoah and they were given cooked meal from the heavens. They still didn't believe Allah and they chose to turn away from Allah, then we need to turn our back to them. The current status quo in the mid east is also another reason as why we should never have anything to do with them. If let say Somaliland ever any diplamatic relationship, then you should know Isreali would be using us for their own interests and not so much of what would be in it for Somaliland.

 

"so please spare us the two faced arab lines"

 

I am more Arab, so even there we have a reason to side with the Arabs besides holding the same believes if that wasn't good enough for you sir.Anyways Isreal hasn't even mentioned or said anything about recognising Somaliland, so why all of sudden feel to be on their side of the argument.

[Naxar Nugaaleed]

^^

Brother, I think what have said is one of the main problems of a return to nationhood. by this, I am refering your opinion that only under the right leadership will support unity, tel then, you will support the dismemberment of our nation. A sociaty can not be governed if every one, every entity, every group believes they have right to veto every action of sovereign government. It always bother when I read that clan so and so, adminitration so and so and hebel aya "kalsoonidi kala noqdey" so and so. In a democratic society, unless we want to remain in anarchy forever, a citizen must accept the will of the majority. I don't like so and so will can not be accepted as a legtemate reason to reject the will of an entire nation. For those who have made a sport out of bashing the character of our president and find it reasonable to reject or accept government based on their affinity for or hate of a certain leader, please. How can their be governance in a sociaty were everyone, person, group, faction, party, region, clan is veto wielding entity? Can you imagine this in any nation but ours? Even in America were the most of the citizens (more then 62%) do not approve of the their national leadership, do not demand such a thing. The will of one can not overide that of the majority.

[Qudhac]

OOdweyne

 

 

As you have put it, its not really worthy of anyones time to answer challenged kids of those defeated lot, but what you have to understand is children like him are put to sleep on these kind poison they spew out of the wrong end if i put it frankly, but be it so if this lessons their burning hatred and makes them get few hours of decent sleep then who are we to deny such defeated lot their moment of comfort.

 

 

my friend ever since we struck the sword and blade of fate dealt them defeat and us a glory of our destiny, since that watershed momement the children of xaraan-ku-naax, and the directors of that famouse Afweyne utopian clan fantasy have and will always be kicking and screaming.

 

these people who i refer to as Leaches who can only survive when they suck other people blood have always been known to spit poison once that LEACH IS CUT OFF its free blood supply.

 

 

and as always our responce has been in the words of once great poet salaan carabey who answered these afka-nool leaches....

 

 

Aniguna halkaad degi jirtaan ka hawisaayaaye

Hadba waxa ku soo gocan sidaan kuu harraatiyaye

 

Dabadeedna hoog iyo hungiyo ciil ma la huleeshay

Tolkaabaa horweyn ku habbanoo haanka loo tolaye

 

Waataa hareertaada bari looga hoy dhigaye

Wax hortiina lagu maalayaa kii Hagoogane'e

 

Haddaad ficil hinaasiday asaad hiilin kari weydey

Ma afkaad ku hawl bixi cidlaad ka hanajabaysaaye

 

 

[Paragon]

For exactly the same topic, check Here, Here, and oh Here. Oh wait, and Here too. So please, would you be so kind to mind the repitition, its kinda iritating you know .

[me]

Dear Red Sea,

 

I agree with you on many many points and what you have said on your last two posts have assured me of your good intentions and I consider you a friend and a fellow Muslim and Somali brother.

 

One think I must highlight is

 

Originally posted by Mr. Red Sea:

 

I have to say you sometimes put words into my mouth. I am in no way think or saying that you are wrong to believe that we as Somalis should be united under one adminstration, infact I think that is very good if we could have. [/QB]

Originally posted by Mr. Red Sea:

I am just waiting for the right leadership in order to consider myself pro unity. As long as people like Yeey are being elected, then I don't see the point of this whole unity thing.

[/QB]

I understand and I agree with you on that point, but I have to say that one can not be positive towards unity while protecting the divisions.

 

It would be a positive step to denounce the secession all together and to step forward for unity above division.

 

There would be nothing wrong with saying that you are pro-unity although you do not agree with the current leadership as there are millions of other Somalis who are pro-unity while not agreeing with the current leadership. The reason why I say this is that there is no way of influencing the decision of these people unless you participate. One can not say I will sit on the sidelines and wait for the right leadership to emerge and only then will I join.

 

Who knows maybe you are the right leadership, maybe the leader we are waiting for to unite us could be coming from the North West.

 

My brother Red Sea, I am in no way biased towards one entity the reason why I am strongly against the secession is because it affects me personally more then anything else in Somalia today affects me. The North West is my home, it is my house, it is my people, and it is my history, my culture and my life. I am a Somali Qaldaan and I am damn proud of it.

 

If you and I stood next to each other no one would distinguish the difference between us (except that I am better looking I hope). The Somali looks, the same language, religion, the same culture, the same laxoox and sabaayad calool, the same shared history, maybe we even grew up together in the same neighbourhood and if you was born in Hargeysa maybe we where born in the same hospital with the same midwife, so I wonder if you and I cannot be separated by the naked eye and even after some investigation we are still indistinguishable. Why there are some people who want to make us appear alien to one another, who would rather die then to see us two living in the same country. Are they not wrong for searching for petty differences and creating hate where there should be peace?

 

Brother Red Sea, you and I are closer to each other then people would like us to be, the hate fosters and the warmongers don’t want us to open our eyes and see that we are one.

 

 

---To Qudhac grow up man; you can not stop making silly remarks, isku xishood ninyahow.---

[me]

For the respect to Mr.Red Sea, I will post no longer on this tread.

[Qudhac]

ina daami

 

do still stand by your grand letter of Igal.

[AYOUB]

^^ What does he mean by laxoox anyway?

 

Originally posted by me:

If you and I stood next to each other no one would distinguish the difference between us (except that I am better looking I hope). The Somali looks, the same language, religion, the same culture, the same

laxoox

and sabaayad calool, the same shared history, maybe we even grew up together in the same neighbourhood and if you was born in Hargeysa maybe we where born in the same hospital with the same midwife,..

Is it the wooden boats used by human-smugglers?

[RedSea]

triple post.