Salamz, I can see disputes dealing with LAND can be a very EMOTIONAL/SENTIMENTAL subject matter for some nomads and their families. But doing what is RIGHT should IDEALLY not be clouded by SENTIMENT? Why are the Occupants treated with such disdain and disrespect? Its like african slaves who came to north american, built the land up, maintained it and then the Owners came back from Europe and tell them 'Thanks, for making the place SAFE and TIDY for me and my family, but its Time for you to go and sleep/live somewhere else. This is my land now and u don't have a right to it at all.

Originally posted by Baashi: There is no such thing as an absolute freedom of anything. As one famous lawyer once put it, and I’m paraphrasing him, my right to swing my arm at your face stops right at your nose. He was equating physical violence to incitement to hatred implying that speech can sometimes be a form of action. And this is the heart of the issue: is speech a form of action? The problem here is not so much as to whether freedom of expression is a necessary right for a healthy debate and unfettered expression of ideas. NO this debate is not about that! At issue is whether degrading and demonizing the religion of identifiable groups adds any value to the healthy debate of ideas. Should stability and security of the polity take precedence over free press? Another issue is the standard in which the law itself should conform to in its making. Should justice be dependent on the strength of the community and its lobbying power or should the interest of all groups be taken into account in the legislative deliberations? Demanding respect and an understanding of religious issues is not tantamount to shooting our selves in the foot. The idea that if we are successful in bringing down the Danish provocateurs on their knees we will somehow have to live with diminished freedom for it will effect us in our dealings in the Masajids is misleading argument. First this type of argument assumes that violence is inherent theme in Islam. Secondly it ignores the right to worship clause in the constitution. Finally as Muslims living in alien lands we have to exploit all the laws in the books that protect our interest and values as community. If need be we oughtta be lobbying to enact more laws that protect our interest and values. The goal is to pave the way for our kids to live in harmony with the rest of society without compromising their religion. Depicting kheyru qalqiLah this way is not something we can watch and standby. We shouldn't sit back and hold our breath. We can discuss ways and means to prevent them publishing such demonizing and degrading depictions in the future but we should never defend the rights of provocateurs to do so. ^^^^ Salamz, Baashi, I agree with you saxib and this is what I have been saying all along but some nomads prefer CONFUSION over CERTAINTY. Complaincency is what is being Advocated by some nomads and some are being scornful at a muslim thinking to protect themselves using state laws. :rolleyes: In anycase, maybe you should move this the other thread titled 'Religious hatred bill' by Ngonge.

Originally posted by Curling Waterfall: quote:Originally posted by Northerner: [QB] Doing it it for ones self or not, the 'maintenance' occured to the advantage of the owner, thus some sort of comp is only fair but not a leglity. I'm questioning whether this should be made a legal issue. The 'maintenance' occurred to the advanatage of the residents. Ma waxaad ku dhex noolaan lahayd aqal isku qudhmey oo dumay? Even as a renting customer, you're obligated to maintain the house and any damage to the properly waa lagugu soo dalici kara. Thats how it works in the rest of the world. Occupants should be grateful they lived rent-free for years in some1 else's property and get the hell out when the owners come back to reclaim what is rightfully theirs. You sound like a Tyrant! Where is the Humanity? The Generosity? What if there was minimal or no contact with the Owner for 10+yrs and the occupant took care of the home all that time and rebuilt it,fought others to maintain it etc.?

Hate behind right-wing blogburst No need to publish offensive cartoons ANTONIA ZERBISIAS Well that didn't take long. While Muslim religious extremists are rioting in the streets of Beirut, Gaza City and Kabul, Scandinavian embassies are being torched and Jordanians are deprived of their Danish feta over cartoons that were never actually published in any legitimate newspaper, the right-wing blogosphere has been staging its own "blogburst": the act of reproducing the offending depictions of the Prophet Muhammad. It's a "simultaneous, co-ordinated posting by a large group of webmasters and bloggers on a given topic," says Israpundit who, along with Michelle Malkin, who is like Ann Coulter but not as funny and not so skinny, are leading the cartoon crusade. Follow their politics and you'll understand why they're on this particular blogwagon: they hate Muslims. In fact, if they were to write about Jews the way they sometimes do about followers of the Prophet Muhammad, they'd be denounced as anti-Semites or Holocaust deniers. So it isn't surprising that some of their more eager acolytes have gone far beyond denigrating the fanatical rioting, which has, at deadline, claimed six lives and left hundreds of wounded. No doubt, the Kartoon Karnage Kapers are inexcusable, and threaten to escalate into even more senseless death and destruction. That's why the absolute glee with which this has been received by the online cons strikes me as so puzzling. Do they enjoy the blood sport of watching out-of-control Muslim mobs in the streets? It's also bemusing to see how they have suddenly declared solidarity with the heretofore "appeasers" of Europe for republishing the cartoons. (Interestingly, one explanation for the sudden resurgence of these offending drawings after their initial appearance last September was that a so-called Christian magazine in Norway republished them. Why it chose to do so is unclear.) In issuing their fatwa on the Muslims who are calling for the heads of people whose mightiest weapon is the pen, the North American pyjamahadeen have gone too far , using the incident as another reason to bash Muslims and sow further divisions between what are already "clashing civilizations." It's like they have been waiting for just this opportunity..... Source The internet is a HAVEN for people that love to feed of their EGO's, their OPINIONATIONS and the Blogger phenonmena has fed this on this. Anyways, the term pyjamahadeen is an amusing term.

Originally posted by Northerner: An NGO recently started registering lands that are 'known' to be owned. Not sure exactly what the score is with disputed lands. This raises the question: Should people be fully entitled to lands they left during the war which has been occupied by others? If you have been living in the west with land back home which is occupied and looked after by its new occupants over the past 15-20 years, should they be entitled to some of that land? sALAMZ, GOOD question and it is a fiqh issue of which i don't know about. Maybe some nomads can help us out on this. Should there be Shares btwn land Owner and Occupant in the house/land especially when the owner of that land/house did not pay taxes, maintain the home etc. for several years and all those responsibilities rested on the shoulder of the Occupant?

Originally posted by General Duke: ^^^ You have some valid points however people must understand that there are more than 1.6 Billion Muslims living in eevery corner of the globe. Thus reaction will differ, some will keep quite, others demonstrate and others resort to other means. Yet so far what has happened has been mild, a boycot and the destruction of few buildings. Now it is to be expected from the west to cry foul, to say this [our demosntartions] has been over the top. However the actions so far have been nothing to the true anger that we feel. Our Prophet is everything to us, he PBUH is the very example of how to live. It is to be expected also that they will never like him, but we expect that they keep that to themselves. ^^^^ I agree with you saxib Its as if the Muslims have to GET PERMISSION HOW they want to REACT to something. (Pro-acting is forbidden for muslims b/c thats often labelled as an act of your know what!) Its like the muslim has to get an OK from the Western Media and governements HOW to DEFEND their Deen, How to DEFEND their beloved Rasul (salallahu calihye wasilm) and sadly enough, some muslims have fallen into that trap of subserviance, humuliation etc. e.g The muslim can only demonstrate on a Sunday, the muslim can come out with an Action Plan but that Action Plan has to be approved by the Dominant powers that be, the muslim can't yell Allahu Akbr beyond 1 decibel and all other nonsensical protocls that the muslims have to abide by. Democracy is the art and science of running the circus from the monkey cage. H. L. Mencken I like that quote, GD.

Originally posted by Socod_badne: quote:Originally posted by zahra.J: I am from China.. I would like to understand your country and colture and life. I want to meet you every one and we will become good friend. It is customary in this place that before one is welcomed they state their qabiil. This is usually done in their introductory thread. Like this one by you. However, I noted you haven't stated your qabiil. Undoubtedly the most egregious affront one can dish out, I personally took great umbrage to it. Talk about making a bad enterance! You can redeem your blemishes. All you must do is state your qabiil and all is forgiven. But be forewarned: forebearance is not part of our lexicon. You MUST state your qabiil! Keep in mind some qabiils are more holy than others, so think carefully dear! In the meantime, you're very unwelcome to SOL. ^^^^ Ignore him, I say state your Chinese Province?

Salamz, All I can see in this thread is how the shaytan has turned an issue of Islamic Pride into sectarianism (by one individual). I say Ignore Sayid and close this thread. I was just watching news about muslim reactions around the world, and I saw sunnis, shias, salafis,sufis, maliasians, iranians, indians,arabs, talk of somalians etc. come out and protest all in unite under the SHAHADA, which TIES US ALL and especially the personality of the RASUL (salallahu caliyhe wasilm). I can not recall a single moment in ALL MY LIFE wherein the whole UMMAH was UNITED on an issue such as the one that has arisen the past few weeks. I have seen nonhijabis coming out in support for the rasul (salallahu caliyhe wasilm) honor, the Modern muslim coming out in support of the rasul's (salallahu caliyhe wasilm) honor etc... Walahi, it brings hope and reassurance inshallah, that all is not lost, interms of the Collective Iman of the Ummah. Fi Amanillah

Salamz, Sayid, Allah yahdeeka saxib! Its this hate for other muslims that has divided and craved up the ummah! You are preaching tafreeq and secterianism and spread poison. The shaytan loves to spread hatred among the believers because hatred and secterianism is contrary to TAWHID/UNITY. In anycase, concentrate on the good and what is khayr inshallah because we are often persuaded by our nafuus/selfs to see the BAD in others. Time tells the best tale! Fi Amanillah.

Originally posted by Northerner: Allah yarxamu to the deceased, Sad indeed, the double selling of lands is now common place and anyone hoping to buy should first make sure the land actually belongs to the seller. Where were the land registry dept? Salamz, This could easily escalate into a tribal rivalry in no time, so I think that Mediating the problem ASAP to prevent 'gossiping' and 'furhter bloodshed' is good idea. Land registery department would be a good idea, there might be one there already, who knows? Fi Amanillah

Originally posted by Northerner: Sheh, not sure uf your still at work but if you are i suggest you make wudu (even if you already have it) then re-work your work until it is done, i dont think you should go home b4 its finished,,,,and stay away from SOL She needs Stress management 101 and 102.

Originally posted by checkmate: In an effort to stem a potential trade backlash, the New Zealand government is to explain to Iranian officials that it has no control over what the media publishes in New Zealand. Iran's President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has ordered the cancellation of economic contracts with countries where the media have published cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed. Iran is setting up a committee to review economic and commercial deals with these countries. Copies of the cartoons were published in The Dominion Post and The Press on Saturday. New Zealand exports up to $100 million of products a year to Iran, and does about $1.5 billion worth of trade with Islamic countries. New Zealand Minister of Trade Phil Goff says it will be explained to Iran that neither the government nor exporters had any influence over what he calls the media's "regrettable" decision. Source MashaAllah, its a game of Economics! Sayid, Saxib, take a shaax break for a min.!

Salamz, Inshallah/God willing, my Allah preserve your Iman/Faith.

Originally posted by Nur: Ibn Abbas bro JZK for the exhautive vision you have shared, in addition we need to organize the community abroad to form an educational association to make the change for a better future. We need to bring up children who are highly analytical, sharp minded, tolerant of others viewpoints while having solid confidence in their faith Nur Salamz, I agree with you saxib but its a daunting task and the odds are heavily stacked against you. Cultivating a Muslim Personality is difficuly and I find that most parents try to live ISLAM through their kids, when they themselves are FRAGMENTED MUSLIMS. Case in point, kids go to islamic school but when they come home, their is a Big Screen T.V. de-programming them and quran is not being recited in the home and the salat is not established with the kids. Fi Amanillah

Salamz, That was a bit alarming to have 35men-in one day, try to have sex with a 12yr boy and/or 13yrs girl. Duca, I don't think that somali parents do enough monitoring because the internet is TOO BIG and there are an infinite number of sites that can't be managed by parents.

Salamz, Kashanre and Northerner, JazaAllah Khayr waalyalaal for your posts. Rahima, Ibtisam and others, Inshallah, see the barakah in all this and that is that the love of the rasul (salallahu calihye wasilm) is a UNITING FACTOR in the UMMAH. It wasn't for the LOVE and Kareemah (eezza/honor etc.) of the Rasul rasul (salallahu calihye wasilm) that Allah gave to the RASUL salallahu calihye wasilm) we would not be arguing with others, with others about WHOM loves the RASUL (salallahu calihye wasilm) more. Its a real good sign. Imagine a world, where people DID NOT value the RASUL (salallahu calihye wasilm) ANYMORE but just went along with their lives, unfettered, unbothered by such news. Imagine a world, wherein Muslim children wheren't taught about the (salallahu calihye wasilm)'s life, his struggles, his joys, his generosity, his hate for kufr etc. I recall in the seerah when a sahabi wasn't satsfied with that a decision given to him by the RASUL (salallahu calihye wasilm), so this sahabi went to Omar ibn Al Khattab and told him that the Rasul'S (salallahu calihye wasilm) decision was unsatisfactory to him and that maybe Omar ibn Al Khattab could give him a better advice/decision on a certain matter. Well, Omar told the Sahabi to wait a min. and got his sword and killed him on the spot. The Rasul (salallahu calihye wasilm) did not react negatively to Omar's action. In the seerah (life of the prophet) there were poets who would speak ill of the rasul (salallahu calihye wasilm) and they paid the price for their slander against the rasul (salallahu calihye wasilm). In anycase, Inshallah, Allah is being remembered in All of this. Fi Amanillah

Originally posted by LayZieGirl: [QB] I have news for you, if the world was out to disrespect my family, my character, my entire being, I would react differently than I did regarding this issue, I would retaliate, because thats my family, and no shimbir in her right mind would even speak of my family in the same breath. It doesn't mean I am less devoted to my religion, and that my religion is less important than my family. What it means, you lil shimbir is that no amount of shouting will undo the damage caused by a pencil and paper, thats why I AM PUTTING MY TIME TO SOME GOOD USE, INSTEAD OF WASTING IT WITH EMAILS AND BURNING FLAGS AND DUTCH PROPERTIES, I AM ABOVE ALL OF IT, AND YOU ARE NOT. You have proven my Point!!! An insult on your Family deserves a BIGGER REACTION then an INSULT to the RASUL (salallahu caliyhe wasilm). re: "React differently... I would retailte" those were some of your words Whats their to argue about now? Thanks for being Honest!

Originally posted by DraGon: Relax Mr. Khayr. I am not a big fun of Ngonge and his bravado but the man had a point about respect others freedom of speech especially for those of us living in the west since we too benefit from such freedom. Wrooooooooooooooong Message!!! You don't need to RESPECT no one when they Insult YOU; INSULT YOUR DEEN! Any liberterian/human rights activist will tell you that because thats an INFRINGEMENT on YOUR RIGHTS. As Muslims, we just need to STICK to our DEEN. We don't need to RE-EDIT it, OMIT SUBJECTS, RE-FORM concepts for NOOO ONE, For NO CUP of Caano! Confusion about your religion, your origin, your history etc. is what pushes the weight of POPULAR SENTIMENT. As your referred to memeber said before that 'DOUBT' is a positive thing and a cornerstone to become Intelligent. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Nur: Nomads That was so intewrestling! I thank CW, for her candid and excellent response, ( She gets an apple for that good job, I leave the significance as an excercise for her) but so many guys are already let down by the tribe thing, how can one get naturalized as Rer Qansax? and one other thing, lets respect her choice, its not the end of the world, e-Nuri can help you become the best you can be, but we cant make you a Rer Qansax just to be considered by CW. Waterlilly that was great mashAllah sis, the message is out, e-Nuri Scientists are logging data while shaking heads in amazement about excess capacity of talent around here. Chocolate n Honey That is what I call a woman who knows what she wants, and inshAllah will get (if she can recognize when he knocks on her door, which is another talent altogether, which many Xalimos lack, but e-Nuri will be of help if needed) Kheyr It all depends on what side of the table on a wedding cerimony one sits! As Madhooun Sharci( Without a government licence), e-Nuri as a business, we dont compete with our customers, our success lies in matching Xalimos with Faaraxs and their happiness ever after, please let me know of your requirements, you are special brother, inshAllah will look out a special match from responses as we sift thru the subliminals( of course you must pay research costs) Abdullatif bro. waan sugayaa responskaaga, ku mahadsanid gabayada. Zero bro. Thanks, I knew that we need a Zero, to turn a ONE to a TEN, you've done indeed, now, wait till the study is analyzed and result of alignment comes out, the polls are stil open, you never never know if you have hit the right jackpot Xaliimo to fill your life with you know what. I couldnt help but laugh throughout ( eyes filled at times) as I read responses, Oh! my people, my people, what a job is waiting for this wadaad? Nur Waan igaa qoslisey!

Originally posted by LANDER: wow. Didn't know how much this story had exploded in europe and other parts of the world, all this emotional talk reminds me of the london bombings. Here we have the same words being floated around fear, parnoia, isolation etc...but I ask you people are you really paranoid as some of these articles suggest? and can a few badly drawns sketches strip you of your dignity and faith? You can try to dictate to westerners that those cartoons are offensive and should not be republished point blank, but knowing western society you should likely realize this would be insuficent to them, maybe you should look at this as an oppurtunity to educate those around you as Ahura might have done with her signs and tell them as to the reasons for depictions of God and the prophets to be striclty forbiden in Islam. If after you have put your point across to these folks they choose to ignore your reasoning and continue to make a mockery of the prophet (pbuh), than let them be. You have done your duty as a muslim since the amount of knowledge we share with others is one of the most important deeds in our religion, you should feel no "paranoia" no "hurt" after all we are not made out of cookie dough and God has given us inner-strenght for a reason. In the end, there is only but one God whether you be Muslim or Christian we will all have to one day answer to God. hmmm, I wonder if you would have the same Nonchalant (Big deal, take it with a salt grain) attitude if it had to do with SOMALILAND or your Family? :rolleyes: You don't let THEM BE because that was the WHOLE POINT of contention that begin this (Freedom of Xawa-let us do what we want to muslim symbols) etc.

Zerooooo, Care to enlighten me as to how that Dua about the Jews, that your heard today-sounds/looks like?

Originally posted by DraGon: This thread actually proves Ngonge right in the other thread. Proves his arguments for those of us who live in the west. and what is that, oh wise one.... because Ngonge does spew alot of Garbage and according to him-we often 'Lack Comprehension' (those that disagree with him ofcourse!. C Underdog said: Castro, at what point will someone have gone too far against Islam? What would you personally have to witness to make you take some kind of physical action to protect your Diin? (Just a general inquiry) UD, thats the good question, maybe the 'KEYBOARD ORIENTALISTS' can enlighten us... :cool:

^^^^ Please delete that picture (MODERATOR, ADmin,) thats disgusting and sacreligious. I know that Johnny Boy doesn't find anything sacred but a post like dat, should get you a WARNING from ADMIN. at the least, if not to be Banned. Unlike you Johnny boy, we have principles and they don't change due to Popular Sentiments and Cyncisms. I fail to absorb both the moral value of " Oh alah ,cursed are the Jews, destroy the non-beleivers " and the logic of " hate me upto here, but not further ". Its b/c you believe in MORAL RELATIVISM and you judge things based ON YOUR OWN RATIO which you can't understand is flawed for the precise reason that your RANK it (Ratio) to be the apex and source of INTELLIGENCE. Again, Our MANDATE is from HEAVEN, regerdless if every Freedom of XAWA follower disagrees. Our part as a Muslim is to uphold that mandate inshallah and to the Muslim, there should not be CONFUSION. We can EXPECT the insults but WE DON'T HAVE TO ACCEPT them and if you and Ngonge, who are KEYBOARD ORIENTALISTS can't see past your HOT AIR, then thats YOUR PROBLEM. They fact that 'YOU FAIL to UNDERSTAND' does not mean that something is 'FALSE' or 'WRONG'. Why? Because you are Limiting Understanding to RATIO and truncating EVERYTHING to YOURSELF. Contrary to your belief, what is TRUE, what is RIGHT, does not depend on anyone's UNDERSTANDING, COMPREHENSION ETC. Truth is universal, truth is beyond space and time, Truth is GOD (Al-Haqq). Johnny and Ngonge, Maybe the Mirror is a Better place for you lot, to gain UNDERSTANDING. You sure do sound like you spend alot of time infront of it.

Originally posted by LayZieGirl: quote:but unfortunately majority of the Muslims do not have much love for the Messenger it seems. Let me get this straight, just because the majority of the muslim community had more sense to go about their usual business then walk in the streets, waive signs and burn flags proves that they don't have love for the prophet himself, is that what you are saying? You think that those some 150 faithfuls of islam who you joined today are making a difference by burning a flag? Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds? Do you actually think you will change the minds of those same individuals who had drew those pictures? Do you think that you will stop hatred just becuz you standing in the cold? C'mon now, those other thousands of muslims had alot more sense to stay away from the nonsense you took part off today, and I am glad only 150 or so made a fool of themselves, imagine if there was atleast a 1000 instead of 150? It be a waste. A waste? A waste to: show supports for other muslims :confused: express their Freedom of Assembly & Association to show hatred and disgust for that which mocks Allah and His Rasul (sallahu caliyhe wasilm) Its a waste because you can do better demeaning and belittling their effort A waste because you are chilling in a heated place, with a full belly, catching CTS b/c of all that typing and they were out in the streets. Tell me why its a waste, Layzie Crtic!

Originally posted by Zero: Well, the Khateeb talked about some of the amazing accomplishments of some of the companions. He made a breif, cursory mention of the current controversy with the pictures. In the end, he cursed all the enemies of Islam in general and the Jews in particular. I said Amen to all the curses. It was nice. Sarcasm from a ZERO Real nice!