^^Lol. I like you Alle Ubaahne. Where in the Quran or in the Axaadiith, does it encourage you in aad habaartantid? I just want to know waxa aad la jubooneyso ee aad miyirka iyo deganaanshaha isaga qaadeeyso. Diintaadu ma: 1- habaar; 2-fudayd; 3- Qof quluubtiisa waxa ku jira aadan ogayn oo 'la maleeyo or dabadeedna la eedeeyo' baa? War Illaah qalbiga iyo cagaha ha kuu dejiyo nin dabeysha luleyso ayaad iila egtahay e'.

^^Aan habaartame, idaaya hadeeyba diin kaa joogto..bal ku daayey e' wax du dheef. PS: Hadaad wax difaaceyso orodoo wax difaac, sida habraha halkan haka habaartamine.

^^Ninyahow, Ramadaan baa lagu jiraaye maad habaarka yareysid? It is not good to curse other fellow Muslims sxb. Yara dul qaado.

^^ So the video is genuine?

Almost all those who have opposed the Courts, have made the repetitive accusation that the Courts are clannist AND not tackling the Indha-Cade issue. Artists have even gone as far as make defamatory cartoons based on this supposed injustice due to their clannishness. Well, to all you skeptics, Indha-Cade is scheduled to surrender Lower Shabbelle tommorrow and the Sharif has made the announcement that he would foresee all activites related to the take-over of this region. If the Sharif's announcements materializes, I wonder what else the skeptics would use to oppose the Courts; would it be: Dacaskii Cali Mahdi laga siibtey hasoo ceshaan Maxaakimta or other subtle excuses. Time will tell. Sh. Shariif oo sheegey in ay la wareegayaan Sh.Hoose 29 Sep 29, 2006, 11:10 Midowga Maxkamaddaha Islaamiga ayaa la filayaa in beri ay kala wareegaan maamulka gobolka Shaabelaha Hoose Yuusuf Maxamed Siyaad (Indha Cade), iyadoo xaflad xil warejintaasna ay ka dhaceyso degmada Afgooye oo ka tirsan gobolka Shabeelaha Hoose. Sheekh Shariif Sheekh Axmed Guddoomiyaha golaha fulinta shareecadda Islaamka oo ka hadlayey masjidka weyn ee Isbaheysiga Saladii Jimcaha kadib ayaa shacabka u sheegay in maalinta beri xaflad lagu wareejinayo gobolka Shabeelaha Hoose ay ka dhici doonto degmada Afgooye, wuxuuna sidoo kale uu sheegay in maxkamaddaha ay mideyn doonaan maxkamaddaha qaabka beeleed ku saleysan ee ka jira Muqdisho iyo gobolada dalka. Sheekh Shariif oo dhinaca ciidamada Maxkamadaha ka hadlayey ayaa sheegay in ay wadaan maamul loogu sameynayo ciidamada isla markaana la isku dhafi doono Mallishiyaadka Maxkamaddaha, sidoo kale Sheekha ayaa sharaxaad ka bixiyay dhinaca garsoorka ayaa sheegay in ay dhisi doonaan garsoor mideysan oo hal meel laga wada xukumo. Cali Muxayadiin Cali, Muqdisho Garowe Online ----- http://goobjoog.net/ September 29th, 2006 SHEKH SHARIIF OO SHAACA KA QAADAY IN MAXKAMADUHU AY BERI LA WAREEGAYAAN GOBOLKA SH/HOOSE Abdikarim Ibr. Aadan E-mail: ampacalin@hotmail.com Sheekh Shariif Guddoomiyaha Gudiga Fulinta Maxkamadaha Islaamiga Sheekh Shariif Sheekh Axmed oo maanta khudbad ka jeediyay Masaajidka weyn Isbahaysiga ee magaalada Muqdisho salaadii jimcaha kaddib ayaa u sheegay dadkii ku soo tukaday masjidkaasi in maalinta beri ah ay Maxkamadaha Islaamiga la wareegi doonaan Gobolka Sh/hoose ee uu ka taliyo Sheekh Yuusuf Siyaad Indha-cade. Sheekha ayaa intaa ku daray inay lagama maarmaan tahay in maxaakiimta dhammaantood la mideeyo oo ay yeeshaan hal hoggaan layskuna dhafo dhammaan ciidanka oo la mideeyo, isagoo intaa ku daray in munaasabadda ay Maxkamaduhu kula wareegayaan gacan ku haynta gobolkaasi iyo hubka yaalaba ay ka dhici doonto beri subax degmada Afgooye. Dhinaca kale wararka ayaa waxay kaloo sheegayaan ciidammada Maxkamadaha ee la wareegaya gacan ku haynta gobolka Sh/hoose in ciidammo xooggan loogu diyaariyay Carbiska, kuwaasoo lagu sheegay tiradooda 2-kun askari iyadoo la filayo in sidoo kale la geeyo deegaannada Leego iyo Garoonka diyaaradaha Balidoogle. Arrintan ayaa la filayaa in ay soo afjarto doodii in muddo ah ka taagnayd arrimaha ay uga war wareegayaan maxkamadaha Islaamiga gobolkaasi, iyadoo warar isa soo tarayana ay sheegayaan in ay soo dedejisay la wareegista gacan ku haynta gobollada Jubbooyinka Maxkamadaha Islaamiga. ----- Yuusuf Indhacade oo ku soo aaday hubka dhigintii ka socday Koonfurta Soomaaliya Marka Maalmaha soo socda yaa la filiyaa in hubka laga dhiga hogaamiye kooxdeedka ka hubeysan kalagii xiligaan Koonfurta Soomaaliya Yusuf Siyaad Indhacada iyadoo laga wada dhigay dhamaan kooxahii hubeysnaa ee ka amartaagleyn jiray koonfurta Soomaaliya Hubka dhigista lagu sameynaayo Yusuf Siyaad Indhacada ayaa waxa meesha ka sareysaa hoola maxkamadaha waxaa iska wato beesha Ceyr madaama hubkii laga wada dhigay beeshaasi iyadoona dadbadaan hoowlahaasi ku duru jirayna maxkamadaha ay meshaasi ay ka bixi doonto Maxkamadaha howlaha ay ka wadaan koonfurta Soomaaliya ayaa ah mid siweyn loogu diirsaday madaama ay meesha ka baxday sharcigii lagu kala sareyay iyo anigaa kaa hubadan iyadoona xiligaan ay meesha ka muuqato in sharciga uu qabanaayo ninweyn iyo mid yarba taasoo ah tan kaliya ay taageerada shacabka uga heleen Maxkamadaha Islaamka Soomaaliya News Update in English www.dayniileone.com

Loool@humba humba. Belo, war sxb anigu ma dhaanteeyo maalintuu nin aan maxkamadaha wada taageeri jirney qiireeysan yahay , ninyahow. Lol, humba humba-daa iga qoslisey...waxaasi ma dhaanto reer-waamo baa mise waa tii la yaqiin ee Iimeey iyo Qabri-daharre? Horn, oo hada waxaad leedahay 'cayaari waa gelin dambe'. Somehow my predictions for Kismayo were fierce battles - why Barre left it the way he did, anigu ka shakiyey. I think waa tii ay Soomaalida furuntiga markii lagu jiro sheegi jireen: waa dib u gurasho ey xaalad dagaal ku jirto. If I know Barre's kinsmen well, I know sahal kuma haran. Allow sahal umuuraha. I remember the 1988-90 Cabaas-waal/Gabyow,Bililiqo/Jees war around Hoosingow, Dhoobleey, Taabdo, Qooqaani iyo Amuuma...I hope the same isn't the case. Xeryihii Libooye-Kiiniya ayaan xusuustaa, Horn. Not a good site. Maalinba nimbaa qaxa Soomaalida sxb. Qaxuna laga roon. Nabaddeey maslaxo ku jirtaa baan anigu isleeyahay. PS; whatever happens between men, it was the unwritten code of honour in the family in aanan lagu xadgudbin dumarka. I hope warkani in uu beentoobo, for sanity's sake.

Loool@humba humba. Belo, war sxb anigu ma dhaanteeyo maalintuu nin aan maxkamadaha wada taageeri jirney qiireeysan yahay , ninyahow. Lol, humba humba-daa iga qoslisey...waxaasi ma dhaanto reer-waamo baa mise waa tii la yaqiin ee Iimeey iyo Qabri-daharre? Horn, oo hada waxaad leedahay 'cayaari waa gelin dambe'. Somehow my predictions for Kismayo were fierce battles - why Barre left it the way he did, anigu ka shakiyey. I think waa tii ay Soomaalida furuntiga markii lagu jiro sheegi jireen: waa dib u gurasho ey xaalad dagaal ku jirto. If I know Barre's kinsmen well, I know sahal kuma haran. Allow sahal umuuraha. I remember the 1988-90 Cabaas-waal/Gabyow,Bililiqo/Jees war around Hoosingow, Dhoobleey, Taabdo, Qooqaani iyo Amuuma...I hope the same isn't the case. Xeryihii Libooye-Kiiniya ayaan xusuustaa, Horn. Not a good site. Maalinba nimbaa qaxa Soomaalida sxb. Qaxuna laga roon. Nabaddeey maslaxo ku jirtaa baan anigu isleeyahay. PS; whatever happens between men, it was the unwritten code of honour in the family in aanan lagu xadgudbin dumarka. I hope warkani in uu beentoobo, for sanity's sake.

Originally posted by ThePoint: ^Ah - as I suspected - this debate is fruitless. You have a vision for an ICU dictatorship. God knows the future - but I believe it shall not pass. Each region and community, particularly the North, has tasted the freedom of making local decisions - they will never allow your grandiose, all encompassing dictatorship to pass. Your dreams most definitely make Siyad seem a pushover. We shall see. We shall see. ThePoint, , it is a very just dictatorship I tell you. If you expected me to mince words and say - yes I am all for democracy and some such none-sense - I am telling you, waa habeenkii xalay ahaa oo tagay. PS: I am glad to have become a self-appointed spokesman of the ICU , it sorta feels I am 'very involved'. On a serious note though, after all things are said and done, the ICU is led by a diplomatic man (Sheikh Shariif) and it is only him who can give unequivicle ICU future agenda. Till then, I am here to say all the things you hate to hear.

^^^Adeer waxba qiiro qabiil yeysan marna ku qaadin. Adeerkeey guryo uu xoog ku fara-maroojistey raggii (qayb guryahaa ka mid ah lahaa) ayaa dib uga ceshteene, sidaa darteed ayaan u qiiroodey cidna kaa aqbali mayso...'aan ooyee iridka ii xidha' ayaa la qaatey. Each day that passes, there is someone in this forum who's allegience to his kinsmen is tested, today it is your kinsman, so is-adkee HornAfrique. It will come to pass. If I were you, I would assume a more humourous tone to all this. Easy come easy go, brother. Something would never change. When the day comes that the ICU is defeated..I should welcome what you have to say. Till then, it is all a discusion. PS; cheer up, Horn. Soon it will all be over

^^^Adeer waxba qiiro qabiil yeysan marna ku qaadin. Adeerkeey guryo uu xoog ku fara-maroojistey raggii (qayb guryahaa ka mid ah lahaa) ayaa dib uga ceshteene, sidaa darteed ayaan u qiiroodey cidna kaa aqbali mayso...'aan ooyee iridka ii xidha' ayaa la qaatey. Each day that passes, there is someone in this forum who's allegience to his kinsmen is tested, today it is your kinsman, so is-adkee HornAfrique. It will come to pass. If I were you, I would assume a more humourous tone to all this. Easy come easy go, brother. Something would never change. When the day comes that the ICU is defeated..I should welcome what you have to say. Till then, it is all a discusion. PS; cheer up, Horn. Soon it will all be over

^^ Adeer burus ma sito. Hadal uu Che yiri unbaan ku raacey. On the topic: I somehow do not want to imagine this happening, having the sister of a great leader arrested. I am refusing to believe that -but I am trying to find out if this news is true and I hope it isn't true. If its true, it is the mother of all blunders.

^^ Adeer burus ma sito. Hadal uu Che yiri unbaan ku raacey. On the topic: I somehow do not want to imagine this happening, having the sister of a great leader arrested. I am refusing to believe that -but I am trying to find out if this news is true and I hope it isn't true. If its true, it is the mother of all blunders.

Lol@Che that is a wise counsel.

Lol@Che that is a wise counsel.

^^ I'll ignore your previous as I see nothing of value to reply to, except a poor attempt at sarcasm. But I will give you reply to your latter questions as they require little effort in aswering them. 1- Do you believe that those who are opposed to the ICU should have thier blood shed as you claimed in your previous post? The evil ones should have their blood shed - no change there I am affraid. Note that while I make this statement, I am more politically inclined than I am religously. 2- Do you believe that the ICU should expand, militarily if necessary, to Puntland, Somaliland and Baidoa? Absolutely, yes. Except Somaliland for now that is. I have other ideas for Somaliland. 3- Do you believe that individual communities have the right to pick their own leaders and determine their own agendas? Where such a practice is found advantagious and compatible with ICU stipulations, yes. In places where the local elders have dubious history or criminal backgrounds, no. In other circumstances where no good supervision for the community is at hand, no. 4- Do you believe that no political grouping apart from the ICU should exist anywhere in Somalia? Political groupings, yes. Again, they must be compatible with the prevailing law of the land. 5- Do you believe that there should be a modicum of accountablity to the public by allowing them to remove those in the ICU they have deemed harmful to their interests? Oh yes, I love accountability and transpiracy. And I also love the idea of changing leadership when it is apropriate . Again, the proper procedures must be followed. PS; we can even have a shura on sewing your mouth shut- if need be .

^^ I didn't have the opportunity to hear the audio of the video but as it seemed to me, it was a choreographed video shoot.

^^ThePoint, don't you see the dichotomy in your paragraph? It is like we are having a north-south debate on international development- them versus us. As far as I am concerned, Somalis are Somalis and there is no theirs or others' or even imposition of one ideology by one group on others. For Allah's sake, implimenting the Sharia by the community for the community is an imposition? That is the sort of question that came to my mind soon as I read your paragraph and I decided not to reply to it. ThePoint: Have you got a special God-like insight into their intentions? How does one judge a person's intentions, barring that God-like ability? Simply by their actions. To date, the ICU have focused on expansion of territory and power. This does not necessarily mean they have bad intentions - but their focus so far has certainly left me with suspicions. Their intentions will be known given time. No. I don't. ThePoint, it says, ‘the Courts’ intentions have thus far been commendable’. I guess you were greatly anxious to lambaste a fellow with blasphemy. It is quite interesting how dramatic your questionings have become in your last posts, suggesting that I have made a claim to possess a God-like ability-Subxaanallah. How can I make you understand this without you becoming wild in reading the worst of sentences? Look, ‘their intentions thus far’ mean exactly what it means, which is, so far the Courts have been persistent in their stated intentions, their actions to implement them and have brought to the fore the exact results they said they intentioned. Now, if you want affirmations to what their stated intentions were, go back to the archives and search for the part where they promised to pacify Mogadishu, which they did. Or clear our all the armed controls in the city, which they did or even their intention to clean up the city, which they have commenced and still continues. If one isn’t reading (and in the process assuming a lot more than there is) in one’s post, then you will get melodramatic and accusing posts such as yours-and that is to no one’s advantage. You have asked me how I have come to know the Courts intentions thinking that I claim to know what future plans the Courts have intentioned. That is the problem with haste; it impairs one’s sharpness and comprehension. So I suggest to you Mr.ThePoint, that this time around, you read and re-read my post and pay attention to the ‘thus far’ before you resort to implicate me with blasphemy. You can accuse me of being a zealous supporter of the Courts or even an unreasonable man, or a whole lot of other accusations, but please do me a favour, just don’t accuse of claiming to have a God-like ability. As you pointed out, their intentions would be known given time, but for the time that has gone; we know what their intentions were. Smear campaign? Certainly not be me. I simply raised the dichotomy between their actions to date and their stated agenda. I am opposed to the warlords and I am neutral on the ICU - I certainly haven't condemned the ICU but I am opposed to the main thrust of their tactics so far and thus remain suspicious of them. I will not address the smear campaign part for now, but I will like to know more about ‘the dichotomy between their actions to date and their stated agenda’ which you have an issue with. State an example where they have made out an agenda and yet deviated from it by their actions? Only then can we discuss this point more deeply. On the issue of support or opposition, you say ’I am not opposed’ to the ICU, and you claim to be neutral yet again you are no longer neutral but opposed , in virtue of the ‘thrust of their tactics’. What does that mean, ThePoint? If you oppose a man’s thrust of tactics, which I must translate as his actions, what else is there to support him for? Again, which of the two –opposition or condemnation- is more detrimental to a man? To be condemned and left alone or to be opposed and fought against? This is a bit hard to follow. So I will just skip to your next paragraph which has much relevance to this paragraph. Allow me to skip. Who’s crying foul? These oblique references to 'others' and 'some people' do not make our debate any clearer. As I said, I am not opposed to the courts(it's a little too early for that) but I am opposed to the brunt of their tactics thus far. So, let's for argument sake's say I'm opposed to the courts, so why would you lump everyone else like me as having done no good in Somalia? There are countless individuals in all parts of Somalia who have opened hospitals, schools, wells etc. I'm sure you'll find some opposed to the ICU - are those people to be dismissed too? Your huge generalizations is the hallmark of fuzzy logic. Those who are opposing the Courts are crying foul- crying foul is the next stage to mounting an opposition. But that is beside the point. You said in your previous paragraph that you were opposed to the ‘thrust of their tactics’ and now in this paragraph that has changed to the ‘brunt of their tactics’. There is a difference between the two words – thrust and brunt. While the former one is velocity-induced, the latter one is impact-induced. Thus while you are opposed to the Courts’ speed of advance and expansion; you are also opposed to the impact or pressure of their rule. That is basically what I can derive from your use of ‘thrust’ and ‘brunt’. Am I therefore allowed to think that your issue with the Courts isn’t about their expansion to, say, Kismayo, but also you are against the impacts of their rule in Mogadishu? On the issue of who did what in Somalia, are you telling me the business and local organizations that back the Courts haven’t built schools, hospitals and even set up courts? Doing such things is good but not good enough. When I speak of the good being done, I mean good in general terms – such as collective efforts to change wider Somali society for the better. Building a clinic or a school is commendable but that is retail – I took part in such things myself and helped built hospitals, schools and mosques – still I felt that was in adequate. What the Courts are doing is the collective good which makes other smaller goods worthy. So don’t get me wrong, I am speaking of another good, a political good. I don’t see how that can be considered ‘huge generalizations’. Me do something against my clan's mischief? I eagerly await to hear all that you've done on that front before responding. By your logic above, until you show me all your Herculean efforts to combat clan mischief, you are in no position to question those who oppose the ICU or like me are suspicious. This latter point, sir, is the raw fact. Whatever I have done to discourage clan mischief, soon enough my efforts will come to fruition for you to enjoy. I don’t need to brag but the joint will of Somalis (and mine) to change matters for the better, has made us even more powerful than the Hercules you speak of. To affirm it to you, until you make a conscious decision to work for what is good for our people and make your decision materialize into action that makes real change, only then can you question the efforts of the ICU. Now stop arguing and do something. So sir, this is the raw fact. Get it? Anyone who believes the universe is only about black and white choices is a neanderthal. And then to apply black and white to present day Somali politics - well what I can say. And for your education: The realist disposition in American foreign policy as espoused by Kissinger, Scowcroft et al is in direct contrast to Bush's famed 'You're with us...'. They advised to take each case on its merits Allow me to rephrase your sentence, The Point. ‘Anyone who believes the universe is only about black and white choices is [not]a Neanderthal’. But anyone who doesn’t see things as clear as they are, must be dwelling in a permanent state of indecision. That isn't a good quality about a man, a man who cannot clearly identify one point from the other, or cannot tell white from black! The application of black and white approach is what Somali politics has been lacking since independence – and it is now that it needs more clarity than ever. Lol. Sorry, The Point, my view of realist disposition goes beyond Kissinger and Scowcroft, and goes back to thousands of years to Thucydides. Your knowledge of realism seems to be limited to American Foreign Policy which doesn’t even consider the fathers of American realism. For your education, Bush didn’t create the words ‘with us or against us’, empires have fallen as a result of it in history. PS: For the rest of your post, I am already bored in trying to answer your repetitive questions, so I will leave it at this. If there are specific questions that interest you more than others, then I oblige to answer them.

If you will allow me, let me say this again Xiin: "For all the wadaad diid out there: be afraid, very afraid, i say" Kow ma joogto

^^ Lol. Idamaale wallee waa lama ilaawaan. Horn, I get your point bro. I think Idamaale is way off the mark - even ealier in the day dayniile seems moderate compared to Idamaale. Nothing beats the news beats of idamaale.

HornAfrique, it is all relative, brother. It depends on how you look at it and who is doing the news-reporting. while Shabelle and Gedo News call this a demonstrations - seemingly by all reer Kismaayo residents- Halgan Net has this to write: Ganacsatada Qaadka oo dibad baxyo ka dhigay magaalada Kismaayo. Posted to the Web Sep 28, 16:20 Kismaayo:-Dibad bax ballaaran oo ay soo qaban qaabiyaan haweenka ka ganacsada Qaadka ayaa goor dhaweyd ka dhacay magaalada Kismaayo,kaasoo looga soo horjeedo go'aankii maxkamadaha islaamiga ay ku mamnuuceen in Qaadka la soo geliyo magaalada Kismaayo. Dadweyne boqolaal gaaraya oo u badan haween iyo caruur ayaa dibad baxyo nabadeed ka dhigay wadooyinka magaalada Kismaayo,ayagoo ka dalbaday masuuliyiinta maxkamadaha islaamiga ee ka taliya magaaladaasi in shaqo ay ku maareeyaan noloshooda ay u sameeyaan ama u ogolaadaan ka ganacsiga Qaadka. Haweenka ka ganacsada Qaadka oo maareeya nolosha qoysaskooda ayaa ku dooday in duruufo adag ay soo food saareen qoysaskooda maalmihii yaraa ee la mamnuucay diyaaradaha Qaadka in ay ka soo degaan garoonka diyaaradaha magaalada Kismaayo tan iyo wixii ka danbeeyay markii maxkamadaha islaamiga qabsadeen magaalada Kismaayo maalintii axada. Warar aan la xaqiijin ayaa sheegaya in ciidamada maxkamadaha ay xabsiga u taxaabay 7 ka titsan haweenkii dibadbaxyada dhigayey . Afhayeenka maxkamadaha islaamiga Sheekh Ibrahim Shukri ayaa shalay shaaciyay in ay mamnuuceen Qaadka,ayadoo ciidamada maxkamadaha islaamiga ay dib u celiyeen shalayto diyaarad Qaad siday oo soo caga dhigatay garoonka diyaarada Kismaayo. C/qaadir Osman Muqdisho Halgan.net --- So it's all relative.

^^^ Lol@dabbaabada wata. It really sounds ubsurd. Waxaanba ka baqayaa kuwa sida raxa u duulla in la yiraahdo iyagaa Kismaayo gacanta ku haya. Anything can be said lately. Red Sea, sxb, well said. Bravo.

ThePoint: Sir - you have no monopoly on goodness nor do those for whom you cheerlead. And let me educate you - you can be in opposition to a faraway group taking over your city/region etc without supporting any warlord. Your guantlet reminds me very much of one George W. Bush - You're either with us or against us(You are either for the ICU or for the warlords). Your argument above has about the same level of --intellectual maturity. Shame you speak of monopoly to invoke a reaction. There is no monopoly on goodness; but there is one on the opposite of goodness from your side. You are asking me, if assumingly in an innocent tone, ‘who are you’ to judge what is good. I will tell who I am. I am that one who sees when good is on the horizon and I clearly consider the UIC a force of good. In support of their good work, Mogadishu of the last few months is my evidence and now Kismayo. And I know, although there are always those engaged in smear campaign, the Courts’ intentions have thus far been commendable. Alongside those whose assigned role is conducting smear campaign are those who claim not to support a warlord, not to be neutral but yet claim to be opposed to the UIC. However, when their opposition is scrutinized, they are quick to cry foul. If you stand in opposition to the courts, for whatever reason (because even the warlord has founded opposition) then you are simply against them, and since those who stand opposed to the UIC have for the last 16 years done nothing good to alleviate Somalis’ hardship, they can be hardly considered a force for good. So, ThePoint, if you stood around for sixteen years supporting or even not supporting a warlord, and did nothing against the mischief of your clan’s or another clan’s warlord, you are not in a position to question the good the UIC has done for the last few months. You either acknowledge their work or remain as mute as you were under the warlords that terrorised our people. That is the raw fact. On the point of intellectual maturity, anyone who fails to understand which side he should be supporting has no claim to intellectuality. If you must know, Bush may be deemed an id!ot , but the ‘you are you with us or against’ is a timeless wisdom of Realist disposition. Only the coward, due to overwhelming fear, gets confused as to which side he should support. If your intention is to disdain that sentence, then I tell you, ThePoint; your attempts are nothing but ‘intellectual masturbation’, from which nothing of value can be derived for the purpose of good discussion. I do not and have never cheer-leaded for any warlord. And nor do I ask anyone to cheerlead for any warlord. But I do find it extraordinary that anyone claiming any shred of Muslim-ness should wish for the domination and takeover of other Muslims through military means. And I also love the casualness with which you dismiss other people's humanity and pronounce that the shedding of their blood is legitimate. I suspect you know the Islamic rules on that. And even if you didn't, simply human decency dictates that one does not simply kill those who oppose one. But somehow that escapes you - and saddest of all - it escapes you with regard to your own people. So you would have other Muslims live under warlords? Or do you consider the warlord a devout Muslim? More importantly, are you saying the tyrants who mistreat Muslims, although they claim to be Muslims, should not be dealt with altogether? What human decency are you talking about then? Where was your human decency in the last 16 years? Why did it not compel you to fight against the human wrongs across Somalia? Now that a semblance of civility and human decency is being restored by those who are ousting warlords, do you even have a right to appeal to human decency? Or by appealing to such things, is your wish to keep Somalis in the situation they have been in for the last 16 years? ThePoint, I tell you one thing; if you or another Muslim or in this case the whole of Somalis, lost their mind and dwell in inhumanity, I will come to knock some sense and humanity into them. Somalia has lost dignity and decency during the last 16 years of carnage, and you are talking about human decency now. Shame! You speak of something escaping from my own people and killings. If anything escaped my own people it is basic human decency and there are those who are giving to our people that which had escaped them. I wonder why you are opposed to it. I will tell you again, if you oppose me in my quest for what is good for our people, you become an enemy. I don't ask you to support anything. I simply ask you to uphold Islamic principles and common human decency. See paragraph above for further details. I also don't make excuses for anyone - I simply ask the courts to enact their stated agenda of Islamniimo and Islax. So far they've seemed to concentrate on expanding territory and power. Sorta undermines their stated agenda no? No. They haven’t. Look at the above paragraph for an answer. If people did not ask for their liberation and some are protesting and demonstrating - it really calls into the question the liberation to begin with. Nor have the ICU demonstrated much evidence of goodness apart from their pacfication of Mogadishu. They have seemed to concentrate on other things. No, those haven’t asked to be liberated were drug-dealers, who demonstrated the day the Courts took over Kismayo. Their concerns are motivated by greed. However, the majority of reer Kismayo celebrated and slaughtered camels for the UIC forces. Get your facts correct sxb. The Courts have pacified Mogadishu and have replicated the same in Kismayo, Bualle and other villages surrounding Kismayo. So, yes, this replication will continue till the entire country is under their control. I have not segregated Somaliness for anyone nor have you shown any proof of that - you've simply thrown out yet another accusation. It is clear that Somalis have lingering clan divisions - that is a reality that must be dealt with. I suspect if Abduallahi Yusuf suddenly claimed he was reformed and had become a reborn Muslim - you would not welcome him with open arms. As I suspect many of his kinsmen would not. I don’t need to show you any proof for your short-comings. The cliché is this. Every Tom, Dick and Harry says I need proof to this and proof to that – or I need proof to my inherent lack of understanding. Most probably what is needed here is self-reflection to revise own perception and values. And so ThePoint, the creation a dichotomy of ‘us’ and ‘them’ or ‘ours’ and ‘theirs’, which is evident in your arguments is reliant on a segregated Somaliness.

ThePoint: Good Lord! Now people can't stand in opposition or their blood will be shed? Yes, if you stand in opposition to what is good and state your support for a Warlord, then your blood would be shed. And who are you to determine what is 'good' and what is not? And according to you - 'so be it' with the bloodshed. Again, after sixteen years of cheer-leading for a Warlord, if you are still insistant that I and others should join the cheering, then you are up to no good. And then so be it if your blood is shed. That is rather easy for you to say. This is remarkable. Is it Islamic to shed another Muslim's blood simply because you claim it brings 'goodness'? So you would rather have us support that which has no goodness in it? Compare the results of 4 months to that of 16 years. If you are still making excuses for Warlords, then you have no point in appealing to Muslim-ness or goodness. We have suffered far too long not to know what brings goodness. The Courts bring goodness. Or is it the Islamic way to demonstrate your goodness in yourself and in your community and then entreat others to follow? I'm sure you know what is right and what is wrong. But what possible reason would cause this post from you - it would seem the old age reason with Somalis. And I am SURE you know what that is. Yes, it is the Islamic way to demonstrate goodness in one, and that is what the Courts are doing. All Somalis are one community and liberating them means liberating us. I can see you have segregated Somaliness in your mind - a Somaliness that alienates one from the other. Exactly the sort of the Somaliness the warlord and his supporter use to divide among us. For me, others are the neighbouring countries - the non-Muslim ones. If anything, I would expect them to follow the example of Somalia if things work out. In Somalia, there is no such dichotomy of 'us' and 'them' as far as I am concerned. If there was such a thing, then I tell you, it ended with the end of the warlord's era. Get over it.

^^ThePoint, who said the blood of those who stand in opposition to what is good is sacred? If it means shedding blood to achieve what is best for the nation then so be it. I don't see the logic of frowning upon the wadaad's involvement in social and political matters. It is as if the term 'wadaad' was at first put in place to confine the 'wadaad' to as little as nill involvement in social affairs. That logic is no longer functional. The UIC forces must increase both power and territory for the good of all Somalis, ThePoint.

Che: Paragon.....seeing how excited you are, may be you are privy to more classified info.You are right somthing is coming. The Somali masses will have to make choice between Maxaamkiimta, and TFG/IGAD/Warlords. And for our sake, I hope people support the courts as they are best hope for Somalia now. The TFG is essentially cleint of the neighboring states whose only interest is to see Somalia weak and divided. TFG is on its way out and the wadaado have the ball on the court, and must capitalize their recent successes, but they must understand traitors,and enemies of the Somali state can doing everything humanly possible to derail the court's efforts. So, it is extremely important that they seek the support of all Somali people, and make their movement a more inclusive one. , Well, I am sure my information isn't that valuable now that the job is done (Kismayo in the bag). But still, although we are almost there, something bigger is on the horizon. Let us hope all ends up like Kismayo-no bloodshed. And you are right sxb, the Somali masses have a choice and I hope the UIC becomes the most viable choice of the masses. As you mentioned, all others seem to be clients of some external power. I know the UIC have the ball on the court and so far they have demostrated clever ways of capitalizing on opportunities. Now the only thing they must do is to garner more grassroots support, as you yourself adviced. There are greviences here and there that the courts are clannist and the sort by coming to Kismayo. But once all existential threats to the courts are dealt with, all the internal issues would be ironned out.