^Most Somalis aren't light walaal. In fact I find the very dark Somalis to be the best looking ones, as many of them are regal looking with sharp and refined features, and silky soft hair. I just might get into an actual fist fight with the next Somali I meet who claims to be an Arab.

Good stuff Blackflash. So another question here; would u consider ur beliefs, or lack thereof, to be ones firmly cemented and resistant to change, or is there some hope that u may re-examine them and consider a possible reversion to monotheism?

^Enlighten me

I'd be interested to know what our resident athiests/agnostics on this forum majored in university (assuming they've attended). Somalis usually assume that its philosophy which sets one on a path to blasphemy, but I'd bet the backgrounds of the non-believers here are more varied.

Dadkan iyo faan maxaa kala haysta wa yaabe.

May Allah grant her a speedy recovery. Ameen. So is Saado Cali pro-Puntland now and forsaking the khaatumo movement?

Blackflash;851168 wrote: That's a good question, I think we all need to agree on what morality is first. The basic morals surrounding murder, rape and theft came about long before any organized religion. It is impossible to agree on what constitues morality, given that its primarily defined as those norms, values,and standards a given culture upholds and deems to be inviolable. Since cultures vary widely across the world, it follows that morality as constructed by human societies is relative, even those often deemed to be universals, such as the morals pertaining to murder, rape and theft. For example, within a nomadic Somali context, killing a relative of a person who was responsible for the murder of one of your clansmen is perfectly moral and considered a legitimate form of retaliation. Outside of this cultural milieu it would be considered misplaced agression and a violation of basic justice. Blackflash;851168 wrote: @Alpha, that's a good thought experiment, apparently these people must've been visited by their own messengers according to some scholars, yet there is no evidence of any monotheistic religion in the Americas. Why would god be so cruel as to punish them for what they don't know? For an athiest who is supposedly well-versed on matters of religion, whose detailed knowledge on Islam ironically served as an impetus for his eventual and unfortunate apostasy, i am surprised that you would be unaware of the basic Islamic belief that those who do not hear of the message of Islam while on earth are not held accountable for their ignorance on the day of judgement.

^Learn God while ur at it too.

I studied arabic on my own from books and tapes, and i'd say my Arabic isnt bad. Ofcourse i understand it much better than i speak it, since i never get the chance to practise it. Maybe i should make an Arab friend or two lol.

Thanks norf walaalo.

Thanks for this Oba.

Good read, which gives credence to my belief that bad and ineffective parenting is the underlying cause of the Somali youth crisis in the west. Thanks Alpha.

Carafaat, it says 'this donkey doesn't know how to read Arabic. Your brother, Abu jihad' lol.

Apparently, the latest victim and the one who was killed before him a few weeks ago were first cousins. My stepdad knows a guy who is about to make his second visit to the grandmother, who has now lost two grandsons. May Allah make this ordeal one she is able to bare, ameen. Something needs to be done in the canadian somali community and fast.

Nudawn, i have a question for u. And i hope im not overanalyzing here lol, but do u think its possible to discuss the intricacies of Somali politics without recourse to analyzing clan dynamics? If yes, teach us how. If not, then i dont think your diatribe against ngonge was fair to say the least. Ngonge and abtigiis are among the heavyweights of this forum, so give their posts a chance and u may learn a thing or two.

raula;847471 wrote: well wat a pic! explains 'our ethnocentrism' & stratas that exist. How so? Because the shoe-shining kid is Somali Bantu, and his patrons arent?

I wouldnt want people to misunderstand my above post, ofcourse things like hijab are important but i think the definition of religious just needs more breadth.

Alpha, i agree with u that there many who have reduced Islam to dress codes and outward presentations of piety, and who at the same time act as moral police by chastising and looking down upon fellow Muslims who do not fit into their mold of what a real Muslim should look and act like. I know many of these types, and have found many of them to be individuals who are spiritually bankrupt and have flawed characters. In my opinion the true essence of Islam is found in true love and dedication to Allah, the kind that will nourish ones heart and elevate one to a higher state of being. Such a person will be a devout worshipper of God, and magnanimous, unjudging, and compassionate to fellow Muslims and human beings.

Bluelicious;847409 wrote: Don't get me wrong I think there is nothing wrong with seeing what kind of forum your getting into before you join. But I do think there is something wrong with a person getting to know people instead of the general forum. If someone tells you out of the blue I know everything about you wouldn't the first thing you thought be what a creep you feel like you have been stalked. Anyways you joined at the perfect time new year, new year new start lol. You are a great member I like you Wadani The feeling is mutual Blue.

Nudawn;847187 wrote: The Arab world you see today is a heterogeneous mix of ethnicities and cultures. Arabs from the gulf don't understand a lick of what an Arab from morocco says lol. I'm offended at how the May-May language is completely ignored in our country though. The speakers of May are Somali and they deserve more respect then to be completely ignored I absolutely agree. Af-May May should be taught in schools across the country and it should be given constitutional recognition and replace Arabic as our second official language.

Bluelicious;847188 wrote: Wadani hmm okay if you say so. I guess you did that to get to know the forum a bit in general right. Lol, y'd u say it like that, like something is wrong with it. Actually I used to visit the forum to use it as a reference point to measure my own ideas and opinions against. I dont always get to discuss politics, culture and other things we talk about here with a lot of the young Somalis i know in real life, so I wanted to get an idea of the thoughts of other dhalinyaro (some odayaal too lol) and where I would fall in the general spectrum. Soon I had enough of just reading and felt the need to contribute, and that's when i finally joined.

^ I agree. Siilaanyo should make concrete steps to show that he's serious about peace.

^ Bluelicious, it's not uncommon for people to do that. I myself have been a resident lurker for a long time before i joined the forum too.

Nudawn walaal, we are even more amazing than the nothern Arabs, because many of their dialects are not mutually intelligable, while all af-maxaa tiri speakers from Djibouti to ras kaamboni can understand eachother no problem, and it would probably take only a few months for one of them to pick up af-may.

Thanks walaal, and welcome to SOL. We definitely need new members like u.