Strong Ethiopia is a threat to Somali people!

[Yusufaddie]

I totally understand where ladif is coming from even though it is not self explanatory or relevant to the posted topic however the point he made a bout the push is exactly right, if the ogadenia was a legite islamic jihad then Allah would have granted victory.

[sayfulaah-almasluul]

hi guys please let us not be divided by ethiopia, I think wether we call the region s.galbeed or Ogadenia is not matter, we can name our land whatever we like even we can call it masno aduun but let us not forget to fight and liberate our land from black colonial power.

[Gabbal]

Whether you call it Ogaadeenya or Somali Galbeed is not of much relevance, but Ladiif you were wrong and did not understand what the whole topic was about. The Ogadeen is not only settled by the ******* clan. It is settled by my own *********, and other Somali clans and sub-clans. You cannot claim the Ogaden as yours, when it is populated by Somalis across countless clans.

 

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/africa/somalia_ethnic77.jpg {Point to the map and click on the button that appears to see a bigger picture}

 

Yusufaddie, no one claims the Ogaden War as a Jihaad, so stop with your nonsense. if you think it is unIslamic to liberate an oppressed people than that is your mentality, but don't get me wrong I welcome your input.

 

[ April 06, 2003, 06:52 AM: Message edited by: Libaax-Sankataabte ]

[Ladiif]

HornAfrica, WHO said only Ogaadeenbaa degan meesha? what do you talking about? I never said that and I have no clue where you got that from. Don't assum things walaal.

 

And those who think I was out of topic, do you have any idea what caused this So-called "THREAT" you guys talking about? The cause root is the ownership of this region. It is not about being christian or islamic country and JIHAD has nothing to do with this but it is just that we had and still have conflicts over this land. Any time you discuss the somalis-Ethiopians hostilities/relationships, this Region become the focal point of the discussion!!

 

By Xassan N. Allah:

 

"there are thousands of somalis across clan lines fought and died in the somali galbeed war of 1977.

the sacrifice , the suffering was enormous, and the reason we failed was because of the soviet, east germans, the yemenis(cadamis) and 26000 cuban soldiers helped the ethio side. we didn't get any notable support from anyone"

 

True and I feel bad about that we lost many lives but do you think the war was necessary?

 

I never said only Ogaden ppl fought the war but my reasoning is that the war itself was unnecessary and we could have get our land if we would have used our heads and not invade another country. Invading an Independent country violates the international laws and that is why we were defeated in the battle fields as well as the mind game. That should never had happened.

 

Takale, don't let it get personal and attack me because it seems that you were trying to potray me as a tribalist, dont do that because am not. Focus on my ideas not me if you wanna have a healthy discussion here!!

 

Adios!!!

[Xassan Nasra Allah]

Originally posted by Ladiif:

[QB] There is no such thing as Somali Galbeed, It is OGADENIA....this s.galbeed thing was coined by Siyaad Barre (R. Allah) and his administration. QUOTE]

 

even though the single major tribe in the region is ogadens, yet the rest of the somali galbeed ppl, belonging to all the major somali clans disagree with the name.

having said that , its also devisive and doesn't serve any uniting purpose.

 

lets not indulge in tribalistic cheap talk, and forget the struggle of the martrys that fought valiantly for the land. the land is somali galbeed, and the inhabitants are SOMALIS of all ethnic backgrounds.

 

i hope you change your "ogadenia" diatribe

[Matkey]

asalaama alyakum,

 

It is VERY SAD to read some of the comments posted by---

 

I am not sure if some of you understood the topic. it seems to me that some of you focused on tribal discourse rather than discussing ethiopian threat to somalia. What does this tell you? i am not even going to bather commentin about it. Here we are in this part of the wordl, and yet we can't resolve our differences. first, you must solve your own internal conflict, then worry about outside or external forces,Ethiopia. apparently, we are threat to one another.

 

peace

[Hodann]

ladiif what the f is worry with you.why are you backing the ethiopi.do you know what the ethiopian goverment did to the ogaden people.

[Yusufaddie]

My input is just this, and if you all are muslim and can't understand it then our situation in this ummah is truly bad off, We as muslims do everything for ALLAH even love & hate. if we fight we fight for Allah not a clan or territorial claim. Forget what ethiopia did to the people of ogaden and look at the root to the war. Siad wanted to create the greater somalia. if i am wrong i stand corrected, if i am not then the initial action was not based under islam hence what is after is not part of islam and the muslim.

[Yusufaddie]

My input is just this, and if you all are muslim and can't understand it then our situation in this ummah is truly bad off, We as muslims do everything for ALLAH even love & hate. if we fight we fight for Allah not a clan or territorial claim. Forget what ethiopia did to the people of ogaden and look at the root to the war. Siad wanted to create the greater somalia. if i am wrong i stand corrected, if i am not then the initial action was not based under islam hence what is after is not part of islam and the muslim.

[Rahima]

Yusufaddie,

With all due respect akhi I don’t believe you are in a position to decide the legitimacy of the jihad in Somali Galbeed (personally I don’t care if it was a word coined by Siad Barre- the point is you all know what it is I am speaking of). The reason for this akhi is that the Scholars of this great religion have already come to a conclusion concerning this. These are people who are far more knowledgeable than you and I and are in a better position to decide. They have (many Islamic scholars ranging from the late Shaykhs Naasirudiin Al-Bani and Ibn Baz to the Somali scholar Shariif Abdinuur) taking into account the conditions for a war to be jihad, decided unanimously that it is indeed JIHAD.

 

Akhi unless you know what happens in the area then do not judge. Our fellow brethren are persecuted and tortured day in day out for their beliefs. In some certain areas if you are spotted with a Qur’an, then that is a good enough reason to be interrogated (and believe me its not the type we know of) not to mention carrying a siwak can lead you the same punishment. Believe me, i should know, i have family members that have first hand experience (and no i am not Ogaadeen). You tell me then, would you say that these people are not oppressed by this kufaar regime. The jihad of the mujaahidiin (as they so rightly deserve to be named and may Allah accept their sacrifice and write them down as Shuhadaa’) is against the oppressive kufaar regime and yes they do realise over 50% of the Ethiopian people are Muslims. The Mujaahidiin akhi are not just Somalis (although they do make up the vast majority of them) but also Oromos and others.

 

 

Forget what ethiopia did to the people of ogaden and look at the root to the war. Siad wanted to create the greater somalia.

No akhi, you forget Siad Barre, this is far greater than him. If it just so happens that he misused the jihad for his own nationalistic beliefs, then that is unto him, it does not take anything away from the jihad. Even at the time of Rasuallah (s.a.w) there were certain individuals who fought in jihads but their intentions were for tribal reasons, but nevertheless, it would still be considered a jihad. Inamal acmaal bin niyaat (actions are judged by intention).

 

if the ogadenia was a legite islamic jihad then Allah would have granted victory.

Subxanallah! Akhi it is Allah in His infinite wisdom that decides when victory to the believers will come, and if it hasn't come yet, even if it doesn't come for another 100 years, we MUST NEVER loose hope in Allah. Victory will come, Allah has promised success to the believers over the Kufaar. I hope for the sake of your diin and not just issue that you retract from that view. For the reason that the logic that a war cannot be classified as jihad because Allah has yet to give them victory is against Islam. If you want to argue your view, then i doubt this is a point you should be expressing.

 

As you can see, this touched a nerve in me and hence appologise if i seemed harsh at any point and for the overly long post. It was not my intention.

 

Alaahumansuril mujaahidiin fii kuli makaan. Alaahuma acizal islaama wal muslimiin.

 

May Allah guide us to siraad al-mustaqiim.

wa bilaahi tawfiiq.

[mojam]

I feel that everybody that posted on this topic is somewhat right.

 

The Ogaden war could be considered a Jihad if you look at it from the oppression point of view.

 

But if you look at the motives behind that war, it should make it clear that somalia went to war on the grounds of nationalism.

[Gabbal]

Rahima, abaayo, Allah khayr iyo sharaf naftaada hasaaro.

 

This is when i fell in love with you: "Subxanallah! Akhi it is Allah in His infinite wisdom that decides when victory to the believers will come, and if it hasn't come yet, even if it doesn't come for another 100 years, we MUST NEVER loose hope in Allah."

 

True, Inamal acmaalu bin niyaati (actions are judged but by intentiosn). If it was Siad barre's intentions to go to war over the Ogaden for nationalistic reasons then Allaah subxanu watacala

will judge him by his intentions, but if it is in our intentions to liberate Somali galbeed from almost slavery then Allah subxanu watacala will judge us by our intentions.

[Che -Guevara]

Wat ever Barre's intentions were, lets not forget somalis of all clans fought bravely to free our land and people.Their intentions were sincere. They fought to unite somalia. SomaliGalbeed lives under ethopian terror. Any wars initiated by somalis to get rid off ethopian terror is certainly justifable. Those who say otherwise, tell that to the young somali gals raped by ethopian army thugs who infect our sistters with AIDS. No somali should live under foriegn rule whether be somaligalbeeb or somali Kenya. Iam not arguing for greater somalia, but i wish to see an indepedent Somaligalbeed , and let them decide if they wanna be their own country and join the union!

[Yusufaddie]

From the isnad of Ahmad Rahimullah he says rasulullah said" the knots of islam each would be loosened firstly with ruling and lastly with Salah"

Since the loosened knot of the islamic ruling system (Khilafah) in 1924. muslims all over the world does not have the full protection of the deen as allah says in Maida 49 " They do not believe if they do not rule by that which i sent" this statement by Allah subhanallah in fiqh terms is dhahir.

Now in the case of jihad under the laws which allah has revealed no scholar no matter how intelligent or inspired is he has the right to declare jihad, this is a sole privelage of the Amir or the khilafah. If all the ulema gather to declare jihad it would be baatil as i said only the amir has that priveledge. now we at this present time are unfortunate as we have no amir or khilafah for the ummah and i do not want to go into the various hadeeth about this as we should be aware.

When i made the statement that Allah would have granted victory i would like to re inforce that Wallahi if it was a jihad in the eyes of Allah victory would have been granted. My daleel for this is the saying of the exalted " Establish our foot holding to be strong against the unbelievers and let make us victorious over the unbelievers" and of the saying of rasullah, "Oh allah let not my ummah be oppressed or defeated by the unbelievers"

If one studies tareekhul islamiyyah one would realise that whenever the amir of those time declared jiahd they were victorious, only up until the 17th century when the ottomans started to adopt european ideology for example the creation of the elite janisarry.

Before you are somali u r a muslim, somalia would worth nothing if it was a land inhabited by al kuffar.

tha point i am trying to make is simple and clear. Islam is the COMPLETE, NATURAL WAY ordained by ALLAH. in every aspect of life islam has an answer and direction for, hence for the revival of the ummah which somalia is just a small part, we have to re-embark upon the ruling system of islam, and further more i am saying somalia has the chance to be the catalyst for such an embarkation.

[Baashi]

Ethiopia is a threat to Somalia. Somalia is a threat to Ethiopia's territorial integrity...atleast that's how they see it. It is sad but true that we are very vulnerable today and Ethiopia has what resembles a state and all the benefits state have whether that be diplomatic outlet to other states, security, agenda, access to credit so they can borrow money, etc. We don't have all of that today. Political vacuum left by the collapse of former regime resulted anarchy. Thus we are in a hole...it seems Ethiopia is taking advantage of that...its finger prints is all over our political landscape...its intentions, in my opinion, are not sincere the least to say.

 

We have unresolved issue and that is land dispute. It is preferable if we can liberate our brothers peacefully. We, most of us, believe that Ethiopia controls Somalis and their land against their will. It acquired this land illegaly and by force with help of European colonial powers. It is well documented when and how they had acquired our land. We know the date, the location, and the signatories.

 

Victims are Human beings, Muslims and Somalis. They are poor, weak, oppressed Somalis. Their hope: United strong Somali state with right leadership has not yet materialized. It is unlikely that Ethiopia will grant their independence without any kind of pressure or advocacy from Somali state.

 

What regime went war or what motives it had is beside the point and actually irrelevent except we should learn from our mistakes...they are oppressed people that need to be liberated...that is the whole piont...are they in need of our help to free themselves from Habasha and their Coptic Christian values? In the same token, Jihad or no Jihad they need whatever help they can get from Muslim brothers. BTW, Any one who tries to take, let alone occupy, ur property, dignity, or threatens ur life in any manner is culprit...u are allowed, by our Islamic religion, to wage a war against them provided u say first: "hadii allahaa alla yahay i nabad gali.." in other words u warn them according the dictates of our religion. The principle of moral rightness dictates that u have the freedom god decreed and protection of the just government. Don't caught up with clannish politics and the mistakes of previous brutal regime or that matter the Jihad issue...this is clear cut case.

 

Nomads don't disappoint me please!