The situation of the american muslims who voted

[Member-sol-]

http://www.anwar-alawlaki.com/2008/1...ions-are-over/

 

 

Quote:

One of the characteristics of a humiliated and oppressed community is their submission to their oppressor and their tolerance of oppression. On the other hand they are arrogant and intolerant among themselves. This is how it was with Banu Israel when living under the Pharaoh. I am sorry to state this but unfortunately this attitude is been reflected by many American Muslims who humiliated themselves by voting for candidates who have no serious concern for their issues.

I mentioned in my previous post:

 

 

The perception the American Muslims are giving is that by giving them nothing substantial and by giving them just a little bit of recognition you can get their support, vote and loyalty even if you carry on your war against their brothers and sisters. Just like a dog owner abusing his dog but as long as the bone is thrown out the dog will still give his owner all his loyalty. It is sad but true.

 

The American Muslims who decided to vote have made a fool out of themselves and the whole world knows it.

Under the heading:”America’s outcast Muslims: Once Bush backers, Muslims today are staunch Democrats. But both Obama and McCain shun them.” The UK’s The Guardian states: “American Muslims have been called the “outcasts” of this presidential election. Muslims themselves have told the media that Islam is being treated as “political leprosy”, a “scarlet letter”, or the “kiss of death”".

Why not just call them house Negros?

The Australian newspaper The Age says: “Neither campaign courts America’s Muslim vote.” they go on to state that: “Neither presidential candidate has made a single visit to a mosque.” If they didn’t even bother to visit a mosque, which is no more than a ceremonial thing anyway but does make the house Negros happy, how can one expect from them any support on our issues? Nevertheless the proud American Muslims have been running around in service of both candidates.

 

 

Many American Muslims still insisted on voting. Chasing a mirage that somehow the new president will improve their lot. First it was Bush now Obama. There is a striking similarity between the American Muslim community and the Muslims of al Andalus who chose to stay behind after Muslim Spain fell into the hands of the Catholic monarchs. There are some writings that reveal that after all the oppression they suffered they still had hope that their situation would improve, even after the Catholic monarchs showed them the worst treatment. Since there were no elections back then and no Barak Obama they were clinging their hopes on a Mahdi that would appear and deliver them to safety. A few decades later no Mahdi appeared and their children and grandchildren slowly but surely were loosing their identity until Islam ceased to exist all together in the Iberian peninsula.

 

 

I do not believe that America would do the same because they have grown wiser and more sophisticated than their Spanish predecessors. Muslims will be allowed to pray, fast, and practice Islam as long as it is contained within the spiritual compartment. But they will not be allowed to be Muslim in the full sense of the word. The issues of Sharia law, Jihad, wala and bara, hudud, khilafah, the Quranic teachings concerning the Jews and Christians, and support of Muslim resistance fighters around the world will not be tolerated. Now the spiritual aspect will also be under attack, probably not by the government but by the society at large. The American culture will destroy their families. It will deprive their children and grandchildren of their identity. Time will be the witness.

 

 

Muslims have given their vote for free. Back in the nineties we were told that we should not expect anything back because we are not seen as a voting block (back then the prominent view among the Muslims was against participation in the elections.) Well now there is definitely a voting block and it is quite large as some reports say that the Muslim registered voters are around two million!

 

 

So what are the Muslims getting in exchange for their vote? Nothing.

Brothers and sisters you can vote, you can run around supporting the campaigns, you can stay silent about the aspects of your religion that do not appeal to your fellow citizens, you can speak out against your Muslim brothers and sisters who support the Muslim causes around the world, you can try your best to fit in and be accepted and the end result will be that you will always be seen as the enemy and you will never be accepted unless you do one thing: give up your religion.

“And never will the Jews and Christians approve of you until you follow their religion” [2:120]

 

 

With all of this activism and increased participation the situation of the American Muslims did not improve but in fact it regressed. The Bush campaign of 2000 has outreached to the Muslims more than both candidates of 2008.

Giving a fatwa calling on people to vote in democratic elections is not an easy thing. One would expect solid evidence from Quran and sunnah when inviting people to take such a step. However what I have seen is the opposite. I would ask you to read such fatawa and judge them not based on the names or numbers of scholars who are behind them but on the evidence.

 

 

There was a moment in time when the majority of the scholars of the Muslim world were towing the official line of the Mu’tazila and that didnt make it right. Then look at the fatawa of scholars such as al Albani, the Lanjna da’ima, Abu Muhammad al Maqdisi, al Gabashy and many of the scholars of the salafi orientation around the world who are against participation in democratic election. That is the position of large Islamic movements and individuals such Sayed Qutb, Dr. Israr Ahmad, Hizb-ut-Tahrir, and the Salafi Jihadi movement. In Yemen prominent scholars from the Muslim Brotherhood have finally come to the conclusion that the democratic process is no more than a game that wastes the efforts of Muslims with very little gain.

 

 

In addition to that I found out that many people are asking the ones who are telling the people not to vote to bring their evidence! The burden of proof is on the ones who call others to participate in a disbelieving system, in a disbelieving country not the other way around. Anyway the evidence for not voting are all the verses of Quran that refer to governance as a right of Allah in surat al Nisa and al Bakarah, the verses talking about disavowal of the disbelievers in surat al Bakara, al Nisa and al Mumtahina, and the hadiths of Rasulullah that instruct us to be separate from the disbelievers. There are scholars who wrote detailed papers on the subject and you may find the links to them on the comments made by some brothers and sisters on my last two posts.

 

 

For those who did send me evidence for the position on voting I did respond to some of them and there remains the issue of the Muslims in Abyssinia and Yusuf (as). The response to this is very straightforward: Both the king of Abyssinia and the King of Egypt were not at war with the believers and were both very supportive of the Muslims. In addition to that, there are authentic narrations that al Najashi was Muslim and weaker ones that state that the king in the time of Yusuf became Muslim. But lets assume that this is not the case. Anyone with a rudimentary understanding of Fiqh should realize that there are stark differences on how Islam calls us to deal with those who are at war with us and those who are not. Allah says:

 

 

Allah does not forbid you from those who do not fight you because of religion and do not expel you from your homes - from being righteous towards them and acting justly towards them. Indeed Allah loves those who act justly. [60:8]

Now that Obama is in office we will see how these four years will unfold. I personally think that since what Obama stands for is falsehood, the justifications of the Muslims in choosing him were false and the process in which the Muslims chose him were also false we cannot expect any good to come out of falsehood.

“Indeed Allah does not amend the work of the corrupters” [10;81]

Assalamu alaykum

 

Your Brother

Anwar Al Awlaki

[ElPunto]

^A disappointing and somewhat foolish diatribe from an otherwise intelligent man. Perhaps an understandable bitterness stemming from his recent experiences.

[Member-sol-]

It seems to me Imaam anwar's article was spot on, and sometimes you need "bitter" experiences to know the truth.

[ElPunto]

Originally posted by hamza9163:

http://www.anwar-alawlaki.com/2008/1...ions-are-over/

 

 

Quote:

One of the characteristics of a humiliated and oppressed community is their submission to their oppressor and their tolerance of oppression. On the other hand they are arrogant and intolerant among themselves. This is how it was with Banu Israel when living under the Pharaoh. I am sorry to state this but unfortunately this attitude is been reflected by many American Muslims who humiliated themselves by voting for candidates who have no serious concern for their issues.

I mentioned in my previous post:

 

 

I disagree. And his opening paragraph reveals his flawed thinking. Muslims, unfortunately, are more oppressed and humiliated in their own countries which is why they come to a place like the States. You would think the Imam would know that better than anyone else. There is no doubt that American foreign policy is oppressive to Muslims in the Middle East but that is separate and distinct from individual Muslims' experiences in the States. You can't confuse the two issues and then expect to draw meaningful conclusions.

[Member-sol-]

You are right that muslims sometimes are treated far worst in their own countries than the west, but couldn't it be said that the people who are causing the muslims to be treated this way, are despotic regimes brought to power by the colonials of the west?

 

If you look at Libya for example, the country was liberated by a teacher of quranic school, his name (if i remember correctly) was umar, also known as the LION OF THE DESSERT.

 

Umar was hanged when he was caught by the italians. Europeans knowing that they could no longer openly control the country of Libya, power was handed over to military men trained in italy.

 

The same thing is observed in several Muslim nations.

 

But nevertheless this shouldn't be an excuse for the lack of action on the part of the Muslims, to remove this oppression, and gain FULL independence from western interferences.

[ElPunto]

I think Muslims need to remove the oppression that is self inflicted before they can even begin to tackle western oppression. Barring that - the criticism and cries of the like found in Imam Awlakis comment above are akin to pissing in the wind.

[Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar]

The writer has a point, and I do have to agree with him on several points. Well put.

 

I have had yet to have seen Obama oo dhahay during his long campaigns, waana kii ugu roonaana kuwaas isa soo wada sharxay: "I am not Muslim, not that there is anything wrong being a Muslim."

 

The second part of the qoute is borrowed from a famous line from Seinfeld show. Colin Powell ayaaba ugu roonaa, oo la yaabay Muslinimada laga cararaayo iyo diinta Islaamka, when he was at the Meet the Press political show, during his endorsement of Obama. He forcefully questioned dadkaas diinteena ka dhigay wax xun laga cararaayo, an untouchable disease camal waxee tahay.

[Fabregas]

The point bro,

 

 

I think the Imam is challenging the notion that:

 

1. Obama is the "lesser of the two evils" for Muslims, from a Shariah perspective.

 

2. Obama will over-turn the war on terror legislation and policies.

 

He does have a point, if you consider what Obama said about Palestine, the Pakistan province and his recent choosing of a prominent zionist.

[ElPunto]

^I get what both you and MMA are saying. But the fact is we are rather an unpopular consituency around the world. We are looked at with suspicion and even contempt by many in the western world. That's why it didn't surprise me when Obama wasn't quick to defend us although it did disappoint me. Let's face it though - Colin Powell wasn't running for American president - it is somewhat easier to espouse 'unpopular' positions. Personally - I have little doubt that Obama as a person is kindly disposed towards Muslims. But that doesn't mean he will enact our agenda.

 

I think we have to keep things in perspective. Obama is an American and a Christian chosen by a largely Christian, pro-Israel electorate. It would be naive to think that Muslims who support him or voted for him actually expected American foreign policy to change to Muslim interests. First - American foreign policy is dictated by corporate interests and pro-Israel interests. And secondly - Muslims don't necessarily need a president who fulfills our agenda - just a president who thinks intelligently about using American might in the world in order to avoid catastrophes like Iraq. I firmly believe Obama is the 'least evil' of any American president since Carter.

[Resistance]

The shaiks points are very valid and none can disagree with it.

 

But in this election somehow mitigating circusmtances surely means that we have to support Obama, the removing of the Republicans is step in the direction.

[Ashkiro]

@And his opening paragraph reveals his flawed thinking. Muslims, unfortunately, are more oppressed and humiliated in their own countries which is why they come to a place like the States. You would think the Imam would know that better than anyone else.

 

He does, what the Imam is saying is that Muslims will have greater impact and can be a change of force in their own countries in bringing back righteous islamic rule. But he falls short in outlining on exactly how, or perhaps I missed it.

 

Tough topic that affects us all. Although I understand what the Imam is saying, he offers no feasible solutions to many of us Muslims in the west, other than make hijra to Muslim countries which is not easy! Further I don't believe America is dar al harb, nor do I think ordinary Americans are at war with Muslims, this country and its people are in the hands of the few that make these policies that are not only harmful to the Muslim world but the entire globe including America itself. I don't see why that can not change. Muslim Americans have deep roots in America, I honestly can't see how running away from our problems and seeking refuge in Muslim lands would make the world a better place to live. I wish the Sheikh addressed that point.