I don't like the dude (Al-Ghazali).

Originally posted by nameless_chick: Salam everyone I was wondering if it’s ok for a Somalia girl not to know how to cook? Under NO attenuating circumstances is it ok!!!! I can't over stress this point. A girl/woman must know how to cook. If not, then that girl/woman is a failure... first and foremost as a human being, then as a daughter, sister and a wife if so lucky. What are you (as a girl) good for if you can't cook? Lead, rule, invent, innovate, fight, protect? Nothing, nada, zilch... absolutely diddly squat. You're what's called cilmi bacaac, seduced by Western lies about gender equality and all the crap... then you got the temerity to ask ****** question, with your shenanigans and all here --the premier somali forum on the net. Get the hell outta here... go on walk about, dance with aborigines, chase crocodiles, feed kangaroos or something. We don't need little confused and Kufar catechized young girls stirring our little serene and still pond called SOL. Go away and never come back!

Originally posted by Khalaf: ^^^^Are u even somali ? La! She's sheegato.

Originally posted by xiinfaniin: So I shall ignore your ceaseless rants as you are a complete waste. More like complete concession of your inability to answer my question. You can use all the excuses in the book all you like, the fact remains you have not yet, not even ONCE, substantively addressed my question. You wrote 100s of words but haven't in any meaningful way addressed my question I put to you innumerable times. The only reasonable explanation is answering it is a little too uncomfortable for you. You still got chance: explain why you reject Allah's explicit commands in the Quran in favour of Old Testament law? Extracts from Deuteronomy 13:6 to 13:10: If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; (13:6) But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. (13:9) And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the LORD thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage. (13:10)

Has anyone else noticed how EVERY topic covering women's rights (the West vs muslim/3rd world) degenerates into the female body and what she wears? Very telling given these who assail against rights alloted Western women are the same self-appointed champions of muslimahs. But the first thing that springs to their minds when discussing women's right is the female body and what she wears trumping all other considerations. Duplicitous, smarmy bunch!

Originally posted by xiinfaniin: One can’t doubt the lawfulness of his actions and commands and yet seriously claim to have accepted the validity of the Qur’an. You are either being shamefully mendacious, obscurantist or have serious comprehension impediments. I have repeatedly stated I don't question the actions or commands of the prophet of Islam, only don't trust the sources containing his alleged sayings and doings. I have provided plenty reasons AS WELL AS evidence/s. Such as the discrepancy between the prophet's (scw) punishment of adulterers (lapidation) found in the Sunnah and Allah's punishment (lashes). I poignantly called you to account for this glaring contradiction -- if the Sunnah is accurate record of what the prophet did and siad, how come some of it contradicts Allah's words? But rather than address this issue, which goes to the heart of the matter -- the impeccability of the Sunnah --, you completely ignore it altogether. Nimble verbal legerdemain and sophistry aint gonna decieve me. I know why you're avoiding addressing my question. But guess what? I will not let you off the hook till you do. It's your call! I'm sure there are other people who'll benefit from you addressing this issue. but without elucidations of the prophet and the interpretations of the learned ulumaa, Qur’an verses alone don’t suffice. That is close to committing shirk. Allah's words more than suffice and what he couldn't explain in the most prestinely clear words can't be explained by either the Ulema or the prophet Maxammed (scw). And who are you to tell Allah whether his words are sufficiently comprehensible or not? You're walking on very thin ice, proceed cautiously. One can’t freelance solemn matters such as the Islamic Shariica, and, in essence, reject some and accept some according to his/her taste. Sorry to burst your bubble but that is the reality of the world we live. There is NO Sharia per se but Afghani Sharia, your Sharia, Iranian Sharia, Saudi Sharia, Sudanese Sharia, Malaysian Sharia... there are so many, which Sharia is that you keep mentioning?

Natural Resources Defence Forces of Sanaag

Originally posted by Xoogsade: However, I found SB's indictment of somalis(in the last part of his comments) to be contemptuous. Such as? You don't say! It would be helpfull if you spell out what I said that you found contemptible. Otherwise everything you write above is dismissed as pure malarky. Do you believe we suffer from pervasive ineptness as a community? Yes and I'm being very generous. And it doesn't help the fact that It has become the norm for every spiritually lacking somali to opportunistically place themselves in the light seeking attention at the expense of the somali communities. And you reached the conclusion some are lacking spirituality from... what exactly :confused: ... but individuals advocating for that change have to show they first care and have put much thought into their method of communication, who they are targetting with their message and avoid any negative outfalls that can actually hurt their own communities. Wrong! The only responsibility they have is to the tell truth.

Mrs. Italics aka LazyGirl

The Lazy1, Could you say that again without the italicized words, reading your posts are eyesore? Unless you wearing your Hijab, I can't address you... so disclose that in every post. Thanks.

Originally posted by Amelia: Laakiin why are you picking on SB ? Amelia, walaaley iga celi ninkan waalan oo raba inuu buundada iga tuuro... I'll be back later, have paper to finish.

Originally posted by LayZieGirl: Why is this individual allowed to post in such a manner in this section of the forum??? Yareey, si wanaagsan iidhageyso. Marka koowaad, adow Hijaab gishan waligaa ilama hadhli karti, ma'ifahamtay? Labo, edebdarro badhan baa kaa badatay ee waxaad dooneysaa qof ku edbiyo... ani waxaa filiyaa inaa afka lagaa tolow balse waxma kama qabo hadaa lagar gaaro afkaaga inaa burush iyo silig iyo klorex lagu dhaqo (industrial size) waayo aad iyo aad buu dhaddan kharaar uyahay! Afkaaga jinyeer u yeelow! Ma isgaraney? His nac nac is getting ridiculous, someone ought to put a stop to it. War hooy wey ku dhufsatay inantu! Umada mey iga qabtaan gabadhan yar oo cagaha cirka dhigatey, oo dabeysha la duushay... yaa ilaahay yaqaan? Lazy1, yaa guga khasbey in aad akhrisi waxaa qoro... mise waxaad dhooneysaa in'aa naga qancisi I twisted your metaphorical arm to force you read my posts? Remember: cyber stress relieve is always mouse click away! Ee Ilaahi ka baqo ee cabashada naga daa. Now, shoo away and don't ever address me unless you're wearing your Hijab. Understood?

Originally posted by Scarlet: ^ Do u apply that only when it comes to religion? Absolutely! You got a problem with that? Wanna step outside, we can settle this 1-on-1.

Originally posted by STOIC: I consider myself to be a fairly intelligent person, but I can’t figure it out what prompted some individual to treat people who ask for a guidance (from someone who came across as fairly knowledgeable )with such affront. Because history tells us they're usually wrong. Everything we thought we knew, taught to us by 'learned' ones always ends up being supplanted by later 'learned' ones/knowledge and on and on and on.... My advice: take no man's word for ANYTHING.

Originally posted by Amelia: FGM is a shameful practice, and one of the reasons its still ongoing is that people are too ashamed to talk about it, much less draw pictures of it. I'm all for exposing the backward, ignorant, cruel and barbaric practices in our society for the whole world to see... rotten is as rotten does. Co-Signed Socod_Badne, Whether advertently or not, this author (who I never heard before now) is instant national hero in my books. Lets not quibble over his motives as that is beside the point. The effect is what matters and boy did he ruffle some snarky feathers. Just the mere fact this inchoate albeit lurid act on his behalf has garnered so much attention forebodes favourably if replicated in the future. They say pictures speak louder words, couldn't be any more truer. Clitorectomy is pernicious social practice for us Somalis that must end at once, graphical depiction of its outcome will only shorten its shelf life. The motor for societal progress for all human history has been HONESTY... brutal, impassionate, probing, demanding, pearcing, dissecting honesty. A society that can't look inward, introspect, unreservedly and openly discuss social ills, is one progress will forever allude. Forget about extricating itself from whatever undesired rut it finds itself. Pictorially sketching mutilated genitals will not detract from Somali girls dignity nor will it add untoward pain or suffering. A preposterous suggestion since what's being denounced is responisble for the most egregious violation of Somali girl's body and dignity. It is hoped perpetrators and advocates of clitorectomy will cringe and hide their faces in shame and opprobrium. Pro-FGM somalis should be made into social anathemas... revealing what they do and support to young girls is the most effective means at our disposal. I say we should utilise it to its potential. But I must add, FGM is just ONE of many social ills. More accurately, it is one symptom of a sick and ailing body that is Somali soceity. Be it chronic qabillism, underdevelopment, instability, warring, famines, pervasive ineptness etc In this light, its unreasonable to expect much headway will be made in the fight against FGM while the cause of it, the sick somali body, remains untreated.

Originally posted by xiinfaniin: —you see elites mastering the art of perpetuating themselves. America is increasingly looking like imperial Britain, with dynastic ties proliferating, social circles interlocking, mechanisms of social exclusion strengthening and a gap widening between the people who make the decisions and shape the culture and the vast majority of ordinary working stiffs The majority of American millionares came from poor and middle class upbringing with no college/university education. Go figure!

Kheyr, What's your take on the issue of Stem Cells and embryos? Pontificate away but stick to the subject. Meaning, don't mention Western Secularism, the earth is flat or any of your favourite subjects. Thank you.

I was thinking: should muslim women wear the Hijab while on the net? My reasoning is this: since the purpose of the Hijab is to deter in male arousal of randy thoughts and signifying the intent of modesty, why not the on net as well. Certainlly, speaking from personal experience, some of the girls here are brashly immodest and what's more elicit incontinent salacity. Lord knows how many times this happened and felt completely impotent to do anything about it. My point is: modesty and repelling amorous eyes extends, or should, beyond the physical world... and must be extended, in the age of cyber world, to non-physical world like the internet.

Originally posted by xiinfaniin: By what criterion have you accepted the Qur’an and rejected the Sunnah ? One is word of God, the other is not. Second, 1 was written, collected into 1 volume, very close to its original date of revelation AND has fewer 'narrators'. This is the selfsame method professional historians use to winnow reliable historical records from lesser ones, NOT mine! Third, the Sunnah contradicts God. I trust God more than anyone else, so I stick with what God said. Those are just three criteria. Refute them or put up. Every Muslim knows, except you, that it is the method of narrating how we got what we have (Qur’an & Sunnah). This is just silly thing to say and egreciously wrong factually. According to Imam Bukhari, commenting on his collection hadiths, upward of 70% of hadiths had to be discarded as false. Meaning mostly fabricated and that was full 150-200 years after the death of the prophet. The Quran on the other hand collected into 1 volume by the 3rd Kaliphate, Uthman. Competent and reliable men with unimpeachable integrity passed it down to us. Your adolation of authority is noted but that won't help you win an arguement. What if they're wrong? You do know that very very intelligent men in the past believed very ****** things, right? And you haven't addressed my question: why are you disobeying Allah's instructions in favour of alleged sayings of the prophet? Do you not trust God's knowledge and wisdom when he enjoined lashes instead of lapidation for adultery?

Originally posted by Pi: You cant even seem to get your defintions straight. Like what?

Originally posted by nuune: Subxaanallaah. To Socod-Badne, read this verse if you are trully following what the Quran is sayin, you said the Quran is your only source, and you don't believe the Sunnah, lets see! "...And whatsoever the Messenger giveth you, take it, and whatsoever he forbiddeth, abstain(from it), and keep your duty to Allah..." I'm fine with that and had you actually reading without any pre-concieved notions of my positions, you would've noted I never said I don't or won't obey the prophet's suggestions. Alleged sayings of the prophet's actions and speechs don't do it for me, even more so when they contradict the Quran. if your answer to that verse is yes I am following what the Prophet is saying and telling us to do, then your claim that you don't believe the Sunnah is just to create arguments and nonesense debates etc, Only if we had a source containing the Sunnah. But we don't, we only have an alleged sayings and doings. I think here is where the disagreements stem from. You guys treat the Sahih Hadiths which contain the Sunnah as incontestable true words of the prophet (scw) while I view them as nothing more than hearsays.

Originally posted by xiinfaniin: but we all now know that a rejecter of the Sunnah could not be possibly considered a Muslim . That’s the final verdict, supported by numerous verses in the Qur’an, and so I rest my case. What verdict? You haven't presented a tenable arguement against my position let alone a verdict. All you keep doing is making one unsubstantiated accusation after another. What's more, you should read what I actually wrote rather than take one or 2 sentenses and dishonestly misrepresent what I said. Here what I said in this thread: I don't reject what prophet (Scw) said or did. As well as explianing oodles of other times that my rejection of the Sunnah, the alledged sayings and actions of prophet Mahammed (Scw), is over its reliability as authentic source. I simply don't trust: so & so heard from so & so who heard from so & so the prophet (scw) say ________. In this episode, my rejection of the purported Sunnah of the prophet was only strengthened. We all learned how the Sharia Law says the prophet (scw) ordered lapidation as the penalty for adultery while the Quran enjoins only 100 lashes. How can Allah's messanger contradict Allah explicit and lucid instructions? One has to be wrong and in my view it is the alleged Sunnah. I chose to rely on the Quran as the most accurate and reliable source for my faith. And since the prophet's real sunnah IS the Quran, I'm not really rejecting the Sunnah per se am I? That is my decision and I don't have to explain it to you or anyone else. Out of the two of us, regarding matters of article of faith, you're the one in more precarious position. Since you're clearly disobeying Allah's instructions and still claiming to be a muslim. How can you as loyal supporter of Sharia law as divine reconsile with the contradiction presented by the punishment for adultery? You know, when two things contradict, it usually means one is wrong and one is right. So which is it? The Quran's punishment or Sharia's?

Originally posted by Abdillah: quote: Do not think that the knowledge you presently possess is changeless, absolute truth Does this include Islam and belief in Allah. 'Cos me is thinking this is the absolute truth and there has been nobody, not a single human who has been able thus far to falsify it. I think she (Ibtisaam?) meant knowledge of earthly dimension. And cut out the puritanical facade you express; this goes for others as well. Its neither effective nor genuine. Not to mention portraying an air of insecurity. FYI, there are no absolute earthly truths. Truth, in that regard, is always relative. Further, unfalsifiable theory = truth. No such thing as unfalsifiable theory. I think you're mixing it up with Karl Popper's Falsifiability concept, note its not a theory. Judging from how you used it, despite erroneously, I doubt you understand what it means. What is unfalsifiable is not equal to truth.

Originally posted by codetalker: ^Which is? More nacnac from you? :rolleyes: You keep saying the word nacnac where it's most impertinent. Which leads me to suspect you don't really know what it actually means.

Originally posted by juba: pple are going in cirlcles! XIIN i know u are dying to prove to SB that he is a non believer but i think ur wasting ur time, although i understand ur frustration. No one can prove anyone non-believer just as no one can prove anyone a believer. I don't think you understand what prove entails. But that aside, what Xiin is trying to do but is miserably failing is put forth a tenable arguement against my rejection of some Ahadith for the following reasons: 1. The Sunnah/ahadith are there so we know the prophet's (scw) example not to follow his directives. 2. Only tiny portion of Ahadith are commands ascribed to prophet (scw). Making the arguement the Ahadith are to be followed in toto rather weak. 3. Since we know some of the Sunnah/Ahadith are untrue because they were fabricated or whatever, any one of them can be untrue. Although we can assign degrees of believability to some. Therefore, one can reasonably pick and choose which hadith to accept and which to reject.