I'm sending Bush some messages, please leave the message you would like to send. P.s. I'm not too excited about Obama either.

Originally posted by Qalbi-Adeyg: Ibtisam Here's you making excuses for the SNM crime gang: Originally posted by *Ibtisam*: [qb] They were political refugees in exile, who left the country to escape with their life’s and then went back to safe their families. What has this got to do with the previous lies you was peddling??? But at the same time, it is wrong and a completely lie to try and say SNM run around massacring people for no reason. :confused: Are you kidding me?? This is your evidence, what has this got to do with Awadl? It is about the formation of SNM, a response to someone who said how can they be anything when they were formed OUTSIDE of Somalia. Get it?? It is a reference to their FORMATION, reread my full post in its context. Here you are calling the masscre of awdalites just 'insignificant/small part'. Originally posted by *Ibtisam*: [qb] ^^^SNM was not formed for Awdal nor was Awdal their target or purpose, that is how I know. What happened in Awdal by no means represents or signifies SNM history- it is a small part of it, important enough for people in Somaliland that it was addressed as early as in 1993. You said SNM were formed for Awadl, I said they were not, and Awdal forms a small part of their history which was important to people in SL as early as 93. How does that translate to support for what they did or insignificant as you call it? I really thought you would come with more than this, kindly post my full post in its context, and dig around for something more concrete to stand on.

See you back track and then you come back again, so now we are back to square one. Acuudbillah. here you are trying to make excuses and making the SNM seem like heroes. The same SNM who were responsible for massacring your fellow somali's, now does that not seem like hypocrisy to you? My question to you for the last two pages is WHERE have I supported or treated SNM like heroes for what they did in Awdal. I just told you I don't know the details, but from what I've heard I condemn it. Do you have selective reading or does everything go over your head. Aniga aya waalan arguing with some named Qalbi Adeyg. Accudubililah. I'm not going in circles with you, either bring the quote or case close. You don't have a point, if you want to discredit me, pick on some other aspect, but this one won’t run, and it does not matter if you bring paper boy and fellow cheerleaders to come out and condemn me or agree with you.

I have too much hope , how is it going dear?

^^^LOOL, sorry qiiq baa iga baaxayeh from the other thread old man. It was not firm enough for me, I mean I'm girl and you are more harsh with me than him, whats that about.

Oh so now it is your perceptions which you presented as facts one page ago. And suddenly it is not hypocrisy, it just smells of hypocrisy. :cool: I don't mind you saying, "Ibtisam, I think you are this and that and the other, I perceive you as that yad yad ya" But what I do mind is, you trying to put words in my mouth and make things up. Been haa iga sheekin please, I'm sure you could find a stick to beat me with, without making things up or extending my arguments on my behalf. I’m bias? not in awdals case, because I already said I don’t know much in that regards, I was not even aware of it until few years ago, I’ve just started doing some reading on it, so in few weeks I’ll be more informed. But even without knowing the details, never will I make excuses for murders of innocent people, regardless of what banner they fly, I find it more offensive than any names you’ve called me. P.s. Russel Peters is one funny man, sadly I missed his show in London.

^^I was thinking of Russel Peters One thing at a time Kiddo, reer Puntiland is done and dusted, I said all I wanted and could on that. I asked you to back this up Were you not the one making excuses for SNM massacre of awdalites? Then we can move on to your other "points"

^^^ well not every, but a few of them. I've cut down recently too. P.s. Have you changed? I got drawn into most of them during my last year at college, since then I've been trying to get out, but can't find the door to lock em all out.

Marx, what about all the time and energy I put into promoting and helping Somalis?? :confused: I already said one does not take away from the other. NGonge, yeah the planes have stopped, the crisis remains. I saw that damn dictatorial government, I am a member of the Muslim Sir Lankan association, they were marching with Gazans even with their own problems, bless them.

Ngonge; Waar correct your brother when is wrong, don't push him off a cliff! Tell him to pick his battles well. AfricaOwn, Seriously people in the SL know their interest in the long run and I said many times, they would sit out Riyaal's term, not because he is innocent nice man, but because they value peace and prosperity beyond and above one man. They do not think it is worth destabilizing their life’s, i.e. the costs are too high. But that does not mean the average Northerner is blind or does not know Riyaals history, they do but they turn a blind eye because they feel it serves their interest to ride this one out. Say that and I am cool, but trying to defend Riyaal and in the process discredit someone has made valuable contributions in highlighting the plight of Somali people, particularly Northerners is just beyond wrong. I get it, between this issue and Awadal it might seem like a tight ship, but you guys have to know and trust that your people know ultimately what is best for them. Duke and his cantarbaqash is irrelevant, you give him and co far too much credit.

I think I can do a better list of what men want. Your first is far too long and degrading to any normal sister waax isku faalesa. I think what you meant brother is what kind of women YOU want.

^^^What happened haji Khayr? Speak your mind Tuuj: Depends, I support them on something’s, other things I don't support them. Much like Hamas they are a reaction group produced as the result of a situation, they are not an alternative nor are they uniformed in any way. Most importantly they are not of religious authority but rather a resistant group.

^^^Marx when did you label me as self-hate??? :confused:

^^She wrote it in 1990, There was not such thing as SL state then. What makes half of her report acceptable and the other part a damn made up lie. Would you come off it. This is silly.

:eek: @ JB LOOL Accudubililah

Qalibi Adgey I'm waiting for your evidence or for you to peddle backwards. You did not think I forgot did you? Be a man for once and do the right thing

^^^You wish, I doubt you would see any sight, pretty or not. Adam I doubt even that would get through.

AfricaOwn and Qudhac jiigaar baad waadaan brothers, and blind support is never good. Either tell us why you maintain that he is an innocent man (ya rabi) What do you think he did for NSS :confused: Xidigo if you mean that then inshallah I shall call you up on it. Try not to turn into screams and timo jijid dear sis. :cool:

I'm just tired of people asking me what about somalia, I've heard this over 500 times in the last 3weeks, it is enough to drive anyone mad. I'm take back my jumped conclusions, baal what are you saying haadaab? Thanks in advance.

Qudhac and Co, the possibility that he "might" be a criminal should stop you short of defending him, even Ngonge line of reason sounds slightly better than saying he is innocent. The guy is clearly not innocent. Xidigo you are famous for your hit and runs (i.e. you barge have an outburst and then storm out without waiting for people’s response) so I won't waste my time. When you want to have a normal discussion without all your luggage and pre judgments, you can holla at me. There is no point haad, I’m not a fan of screaming matches.

So basically you are just moaning for the sake of it. The question is What could someone be doing for Somalia while still in the west that stops them from chipping in to any other crisis? What does speaking out against other oppressions take away from Somalia? I did somewhat read the other postings, what is your point? My response was a general response to everyone who uses that line, nothign personal to you or anyone else.

Originally posted by LayZie G.: Ibti, how do you feel about the sudden "unexpected" ceasefire? Well I don’t think it is sudden at all, they’ve been talking for almost 2weeks, Hamas has completely run out of rockets to fire and its access points cut off. Israel in the process lost the last pretence of why they were continuing the bombardment, not to mention public opinion even within Israel was starting to shift from strong unconditional support to reluctance and leaning towards withdrawal, this included some political and military figures who felt that they have reached their goals. As an advocate for peace and part of ineffective social movement(not your fault by any account), that is far from being ideal, don't you think it would have been better for ceasefire to take place prior to the ground invasion? I mean if we could reason and wish for what we wanted, then I would rather there was no military operation, failing that then a ceasefire before the ground invasion would’ve been the second best option. Now were left with the product of an option. The Israeli pull out will be slow and taken few more life’s in its awake, if they take longer than a week, Hamas would’ve had time to get a few more rockets and there is always the risk it can start all over again (that is if we assume the rockets are the reason) I just want to pick your brain because I want to find out what your views are politically as a movement? I don’t speak for a movement to be honest, I’m just an individual trying to do what I think is right. Other than minimize the humanitarian crisis and the civilian deaths, I don’t think there is much on the politics side that can be done by any movement. Most people understand that this is just a ceasefire till the next invasion, because the root problems still exist and have not been address. Till they are there won’t be a final ceasefire, everything is on temporary measures, and people’s live remain in jeopardy. I know where you stand as far as advocating for peace, calling out injustice everywhere etc but I want to know your political views regarding this on/off ceasefire that always comes in the expense of thousands of innocent human lives. My answer is the same as the above one, any ceasefire that is agreed now is short term and unless it is used as the basis for long term agreement will become ineffective, particularly as Israel continues to blockade the Palestine population keeping them in virtual prison, there would be several uprising which would take a few more thousand lives with it each time. Don't you think that you should be picketting fence's on behalf of the palestinian people by condemning the hamas group who are just as much to blame as the yahuuda?? According to the Israel’s any male over the age of 16 in Gaza belongs to Hamas, who do you want me to condemn? Hamas is a reaction, an organization created as a direct result of Israeli oppression, Palestinians will forever be attracted to organizations like Hamas because they express the general sentiment the Gazans feel. If they were so extreme, so evil, no one would join them, nor would they have come to power. They were democratically elected by the people, regardless of whether I, or you or the west or even the whole Arab world condemns Hamas, the people who elected them continue to support them. So it would not be picketing on behalf of Palestinians, it would demonizing them and saying I KNOW better who you should chose, and I am going patronize you by condemning your choice.

Can you two stop hijacking the damn thread, I can't even read what you wrote. Serenity, err it is a follow up of few semi discussions me and ME had, hence I did not feel the need to break it down to basic but yeah thats true

I came across him very late, it was not until I did my thesis on Somalis and development, he was god sent when I was digging for books by somalis on somalis. Google scholar is great.

^^LOL Adam: I'll dig up the link for you 2morrow inshallah. It is like a skill database for people who want to return back home, there are a few, the one run by the UN is called QUEST and last year they managed to send 80 people back in various sectors. The problem they were having were not enough applications. Its been running for two years now.