because everybody is pretending that getting beat up, stripped and charged with indecency is absolutely normal and logical, and anyone who complains about that treatment is spoiled. this is like bizarro world. what was the boards reaction when the somali dudes were given a death sentence for stealing? very different, but they were men, and somali, so...

im done. i wrote a long reply, and just deleted it. im done.

yes, yes i have. not because of other peoples action, mostly because of my own in-action. question: at what age should someone get their act together?

eh- we get a picture in our head of what ppl look like via our dialogue with em over the net... i think yr mischievous sense of humour and yr avatar are to blame question: i have an important deadline for school and im running behind. should i skip work tomorrw (i get about 150$ less in my pay check) or go to work and have my school work suffer?

i just recognized someone who lives in my neighbourhood.

oh, and i do feel bad... but you know that whole family is messed up. jeeez, i blame their mom. my mom raised me perfectly. you know one time as i was coming home late (dont ask why) and she had the nerve to chide me. i think she was mostly pissed because i caught her finishing up her cigarette. why am i supposed to care if she smokes a cigarette? what am i going to do, tell the whole world?

im surer. ive said it a million times on the facebook board... maybe not a million, but you know.

canjeero, only because i dont know what malawax is, and im scared of the unknown. pucca, are u under 5ft 4?

question: why am i here when i have an important paper to hand in monday?

im proud of you. i could never show such self-restraint. hey, since you know maymun, you must also know maryam, inan abdi samat. we went to the hair salon together, you know, to treat ourselvs after exams. i got a manicure/pedicure and she got her weave cut... i mean her hair cut.

i heard that filsaan's niece who is visiting from houston fell in love hard with this hindi boy in that neighbourhood. she saw him one day holding hands with this hind girls, and now she sends him dead canaries via the mail... he's never been formally introduced to her yet. im worried about her.

its getting kind of weird. i dont know who is who.

^^^ i now admire her.

i have a problem with people using Allah's religion and the reputation of my prophet (peace be upon him) to oppress people. thats my main grip with saudi arabia and things there DO have to change. there is racism in america and systematic racism that probably will never disappear, but alot of things have changed in hte past 5 decades because people challenged the laws and their applications; laws that were essentially unjust. im not hoping for a utopia or trying to fix human nature. i think its human nature to want your life respected. funny thing is, its not just human laws, they are taking Allah's laws, and misapplying them!!! the purpose of shariah is to protect ppl, not terrorize them. i commend anyone who stands up against injustice, in whatever form. she's doing more than i am sitting behind a computer screne. plus i think any example you throw out at me will be completely disproportional to what is going on in saudi arabia. i think a more fitting comparison would be rural alabama in 1946 for a black man and a woman (of any class) or a non saudi man. whether you want to admit it or not, despite the regular injustices that occur here in north america, there at least exists a format where people can speak out against it. if everybody who suffered stayed quiet, things would be very different for you and I, and luckily people are still speaking out. what you are suggesting, is that she, and everyone else who gets sh1tted on shld shut up and deal with it. i dont agree with that at all. and i take this more personnally because, like i said numerous times, they are abusing Allah's religion to legitimize what they are doing, which is nothing more than oppression.

I dont get it.

WRRRONG!!! thats what it means.

for one thing, saudi is doing it in the name of my religion, and i dont think they have a right to. another reason i believe more people should say something is because those supposed laws are only used against certain people. why werent the men subjected to the same treatment? more than likely if they were indian or african men, they would have been abused in jail, but because they are Saudi national Men, they get a free pass. at the very least, they can pretend to follow their own laws. and i do think people who live in a given country should have a say about its laws, even if they are not citizens. by working there, living there, raising a family there you are indirectly supporting the country, so why not say something. the laws reflect the values and culture of a specific place, and the fact saudi has a muttaween obviously sends a message that the saudi culture values propriety and islamic etiquette. thats fine. but how they go about enforcing those laws also shows they dont value women, and especially foreign women's, lives and rights. im not dogging them because i think their laws are archaic, im dogging them because their laws and the way they are enforced are UNJUST!!! there is a difference. even according to the laws they are supposedly following, THEY ARE UNJUST!!! the two laws you just mentionned don't infringe on people's rights to the degree the mutaween do. if im in saudi, and ask a strange man for direction, im tagged as indecent. if im in saudi, and a man approaches me for a date, I am the one considered indecent, and in both scenarios can be subjected to interrogations and abuse by police. the shariah doesnt allow this. huddud (punishment) is given only when a crime has been confessed without duress, or there have been four witnesses who saw the act of indecency committed and i challenge you to find an ayah or hadith that says a man talking to a woman or vice versa deserves physical punishment. yr examples are a little weak. as muslims, we should say something when other muslims are being oppressed, or when muslims are oppressing innocent people so the degree of interaction with either nation is a little different. canada's age of legal consent doesn't violate anyone's rights and as far as i can tell, officials aren't willy nilly about who they charge for sexual abuse and if they did, there is a forum for people to say something and challenge it. a more fitting example would have been the security certificate law, where canada will be able to hold secret trials and charge someone without presenting him, his lawyer, or the court with the evidence, all in the name of fighting terrorism. that deserves to be challenged, and it is, unsuccessfully so far, but people are trying to fight it. about europe's holocaust law, i dont live in europe, nor do i devote alot of thought to the holocaust... i do care about human lives, and about how women are treated by my supposed muslim brothers.

i shave with a razor, of course. i think i know who you are on facebook now.

this reminds me of nurse maids... rich women who couldnt bother having their bodies "abused" by their new borns weening would give it to a nursemaid... in america, usually to their female slave. nursemaids are fairly common around the world, the prophet pbuh had one, when he was sent out of the city to nurture a good character in him... but i think there is something cynister underlying this phenomena. rich women who want to keep their figures, but who want a baby, will pay someone to go through the difficulties of motherhood and keep the glory... no doubt theyll hire a nanny to raise the babe too. in a world where everything can be bought or sold... why is this surprising?

yes, yes i do. but i shave regularly.

you guys are just focusing on the terrorist quote... which i agree, its a loaded term, but in the context of what she went through, what else would you call it? she was working with male coworkers in a public place, she broke the rules okay there is a punishment. is it jail time? a ticket? no, she is stripped, beaten, forced to confess (to something probably much more lewd and obscene than what actually occured) and than as a sentence she is told she is going to hell... what part of the game is that? what is the point of that? i cant believe anyone would consider this "silly", she was beaten, stripped, and humiliated, for what? and she is only out of jail and telling her story because her husband has connections... THERE IS A BIGGER STORY UNDERLYING ALL THIS. they can be ridiculously strict about the deen, thats fine, they can even unproportionately put more importance in one factor of the shariah at the expense of another, that's fine (not really, the shariah is whole, but you know where im going), but when they apply their laws for certain people in certain circumstances... thats unjust, even by the standards that they created. its their laws right? shouldnt they abide by it? i commend her for sticking around. the only way saudi arabia is going to change is from within, and ill venture to say, it won't change until MEN see it as necessary to change, and they wont unless more women vocalize the abuse they go through at the hands of the laws, which are supposedly there to protect them. btw, did you guys conveniently ignore the part where it says she is from jordan and grew up in salt lake? she is as american as i am canadian.

i hope she doesnt have any other kids, cause there is obviously going to be a favourite in the family. can you imagine?

i dont sound like a man... i think i sound like a guy on SOL because i dont say alot of stereotypically girly things. i joke alot. i have a sort of self deprecating style of humour which is kind of "manly" i guess. i think its the nick and the picture really. if i had a picture of a flower and a nick like "desert rose", ppl would right away think im a girl. I never choose nicks that are gender specific. My past ones were "somealien" and "illegal alien"

you guys are ridiculous. this isnt just customs and religion... in fact they have no basis to treat people the way they do on the basis of religion. they strip search her? for what? she is going to hell? why? the whole system in saudi is whacked, and not just for women. if its the law, than how come the men who were with her didnt get similar punishment? i mean its the law right? as messed up as i think the whole premise to have the mutaween for situations like this is, if they were even handed with their protocol i would probably agree with you and say "you know the rules". but the things is, the rules dont apply to everyone the same way. if this woman were a saudi national, she wouldnt have gotten this treatment and if she were philipino we'd never even hear of the story. an unjust law doesnt deserve to be respected as a law and at some point, people do have to stand up and say something otherwise it won't change, and if you don't want to say it, i will. SAUDI ARABIA NEEDS TO CHANGE!!!for the good of the ummah. plus, i think as muslims, it is our place to say/do something whenever muslims are either oppressing people or being oppressed and in this case its a little bit of both. i think its more heinous when muslim nations are unjust especially these punk saudis, because they are DIRECTLY manipulating the religion of Allah, and my prophet s (peace be upon him) reputation to do these heinous crimes. and your example of polygyny doesnt stand up. the reason we cant practice polygyny here is that only one of the marriages would be considered valid, and in islam a secret or hidden marriage isnt considered valid. so we have no basis to cry if we get prosecuted unless your trying to challenge the law in and of itself and in that case i would say hold off on the second marriage until you've won that fight. plus, youre conveniently ignoring the physical punishment this woman went through.

i dont remember. what i do remember from the day i changed my nick is that i was wearing my bro's clothes, his gangsta cap, hoodie, and his new shiny watch. basically, i was thouroughly "thugged out" in my bro's gear. as i was writing my nick though, my feet fell asleep, so i couldnt feel my feet and there you have the birth of "thugged out but cant feel my feet".