Brazil Brasilia (Capital) Build in 4 years between 1956 and 1960. Sao Paulo (Largest city.

Shinbir Majabe;849191 wrote: Magaaladee kale ayaa is leedahay Caasimad way u qalantaa oo aan Xamar ahayn? (sheeg magaalada aan ka mid noqoneynin Maamul Goboleed, oo dadka dhan u wada siman ee aad is leedahay halaga dhigo Xamar).. That's exactly what I am saying should be decided by the upcoming parliament and why the article in the constitution makes sense. I don't care about the city, I care about the federal status. Why some of Muqdisho's residents would want to give up such a precious title is beyond me. @Haatu, we'll see.

Khaliif Galayr said that there should be no confusion, and that the people are no different from the leaders whom he said are anti-Khaatumo, thus labelling them the enemy. What's puzzling about Khaatumo movement is it's focus on Puntland which doesn't occupy any lands nor has attacked Khaatumo movement people or people of Sool (whom Khaatumo still can't represent) and even retreated not to fight for Tukaraq checkpoints to avoid all-out conflict. This while Khaatumo movement people don't want to focus on Somaliland which has taken over villages the past 20 years, inching towards Nugaal and claiming more land than ever, and is occupying Sool's capital. It's amazing to say the least.

EDIT: But what's wrong with my comment if he talks about land borders, so am I!

Abwaan;849157 wrote: lo adiga Suusacleey inaad soo dhaafto yaa kuu banneeyey? lool at big dogs....iga qallee maad iska keey dhahdid aan kaa geddistee....Kuwa MMA sheegay oo aan Xamar waxba ka aqoon baad ka mid tahay oo Suusacleey indhaha ku kala furay lol? Xamar haddii aadan rabin malagugu khasbaayo weligaa ha imaan laakiin Soomaali baa kaa badan oo awlna rabtey haddana rabta! Hey, listen, I am not against Xamar, I am saying Xamar shouldn't become a federal state otherwise it is right it loses its status, but who am I to say that the indigenous people can't form a state when I have one, that's the problem here. It's the rest of you that made it into a qabiil vs qabiil fight.

Haatu;849160 wrote: You claim that Somalia has been through a decentralized unitary state before, but tell me when. Give me the dates and the duration that Somalia held this status. Don't confuse a decentralized state with a centralized one. As for the federalism issue, if in a popular vote the people chose against federalism (we're assuming it's a fair poll), what do you think reer NE should do? Join the lists of Soomaalidiid or bow down to the popular will? Decentralized unitary state is similar to the concept of centralized state but you give more powers to the local level, it's similar to the British system. The federal system allows every region to work for itself and divides power between the central and local one, the ultimate say doesn't have to be with the central one. It's a concept not foreign to Somalis who throughout history have been divided up among clan lines, this was the same before colonialists made us a country. How can you satisfy Somalis with having the central power decide the ultimate say, it's simply not possible, we are backward in governing! At this point there will be no discussion whether to choose the federal system or not, it's too late, you can never satisfy a Somali, it's that simple.

No one is saying it should be replaced with Garowe, adiga Baraxley ku ekow, this is for the big dogs.

D/P

Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar;849121 wrote: Don't they also know that the 1960 constitution did not define Soomaali border. It was deliberate move by madaxdii Soomaalidii hore dadkooda iyo dalkooda jeclaa, bad, dhul iyo cirka. There was even a famous saying that came out in the early days of the republic. When a well-known Soomaali leader was asked where the Soomaali border stops at, he said whenever our camels stop. That was how confident they were. La barbardhig kuwa hadda joogo doolar bas u daran. Shuud, shuud, shuud. If you'd use your mind you'd know that the borders they've written now would be the same if we possessed O.gadenia AND NFD.

Haatu;849132 wrote: Somalia (I hate to address you as such when you clearly think through a much narrower lens), do you think the poor mothers and orphans of the south chose to live in a state of constant violence and hunger. Do you think the poor masses chose to send their youth to early graves or does the blame lie upon the shoulders of the politicians? Don't blame the poor people of the south for the actions of their politicians and the actions of young men who were driven to the gun by poverty. Just because Allah blessed you with peace and others with war doesn't make you any better. No one is calling for any delay (I for one am not). What we are calling for is that after August, the wishes of the masses should be taken into consideration. The style of governance adopted should not be imposed on the people but rather they should chose. If that means federalism or a decentralized unitary state, then so be at. At least we can have a consensus then. As for your progress rhetoric, having different political beliefs does not make one a 'nabadiid'. Rather the 'nabadiid' is the one who sabotages the peace process preventing its conclusion. One piece of advise, you cannot be a society without the rest of your brothers. It is about time you dropped your us-against-them mentality, we're not living in the warlord era anymore. Soomaali waa mid, waa ul iyo meyrax, mataano weeyoo, meel bey ka wada dhasheen Society has its progressives and its conservatives, some of us have tried through hell and fire to push the rest forward. The styles of governing that people such as yourself pose have been tried and failed, so we must try other ones. No one is blessed or cursed, some have had more rigor to work towards a better Somalia, and it is by no means fair that the rest now not question how to go forward in a realistic manner but question but try and shift the debate to implementing an already tested system. There has been no 'we' for the past 21 years, so don't make this into a 'we vs you' battle now, it's we versus you when you come up with arguments such as changing federalism and will remain so. As for the argument against Mogadishu being the capital, it should remain the capital if it has a federal status, otherwise it shouldn't. @MMA. You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows, and I certainly don't need to go to Mogadishu to know how functions. Rather than blame this on qabiil hatred (ironic coming from you of all people), you should look this from a more standard view.

He's bound to have personal issues and is in need of urgent psychological evaluation. Even his wife is from the same people he wants his base to hate.

Haatu;849104 wrote: The cheek Somalia shows is amazing and endemic from the parts he comes from. Viewing all others as barbaric peace haters and oneself as the righteous who know and have maslaxadda umadda at heart! Federalism is the choice of the few who like the status quo and the division of the people into clannist/tribalist entities that serve the interest of the clan only and no one else. Somalia needs something that unites and fosters the notion of togetherness and brotherhood, not blind division and hatred. This federalism rubbish is only a temporary thing to appease a certain block of society. Come post-August when the constitution goes to the people, the wishes of the masses shall be heard loud and clear! The proof of the pudding is in the eating. We unlike the rest have no rejected governing throughout the civil war and reject it now by coming with unrealistic governing methods, we have come with more progressive ideas in moving forward, a more realistic approach for the Somali people. That's why people such as yourself and Oba need to be taught how to go forward, we will no longer be held back by incompetent nabadiids, we will be a progressive society that will compete with the rest of the world. We are the righteous and I have 21 years of moryaanimo as proof.

Alpha is having a realization concerning the status of Somalidiids, it's beautiful.

Sxb, you shouldn't be ashamed, peace is a foreign language to you, I will teach you peace.

That's cause you don't believe in peace.

Puntland's stance is that the federal capital should remain federal meaning the city will belong to no clan and every clan can rule it equally. It doesn't matter whether it is Muqdisho, Baidoa or Kismayo, as long as it is federal.

Why has the capital not been designated in the constitution? http://balcad.com/claahi-fanaxmaxay-tahay-sababta-caasimada-soomaaliya-dastuurka-looga-qori-waayay/

“Duqa Magaalada Muqdisho, Ku xigeenadiisa iyo guddoomiyayaasha degmooyinka muqdisho dhamaantood hal beel ayay ka soo jeedaan kumana matali karaan dhamaan umada Soomaaliyeed” Duqa magaalada Garowe ee Caasimada Puntland (Dhagayso). http://puntlandi.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Duqa-Magaalada-Garowe-ee-Puntland.mp3

Jimco, July 06, 2012(HOL): Guddoomiyaha Gobolka Banaadir ahna duqa Magaalada Muqdisho Maxamuud Axmed Nuur (Tarzan) ayaa si kulul u dhaliilay dastuurka cusub ee loo sameynayo dalka Soomaaliya, wuxuuna faahfaahin ka bixiyay qaabka uu u dhaliilsan yahay dastuurka. Guddoomiyaha oo wareysi siiyay laanta Afka Soomaaliga ee VOA-da ayaa sheegay in Dastuurkan uu yahay mid muddo dheer la qarinayay oo la diidanaa in dadka loo soo bandhigo, hadda oo la soo bandhigayna ay ku arkeen waxyaabo ka dhan ah midnimada Umadda Soomaaliyeed. “Dastuur marka Ummad loo sameynayo waa in lagu qoraa waxa Umadda lagu xukumayo ay dooneyso ee ma ahan in lagu waxyaabo dad dano gaar ah wato ay doonayaan”ayuu yiri Guddoomiyaha Gobolka Banaadir Maxamuud Axmed Nuur (Tarzan). Guddoomiyaha oo arrintan ka sii hadlayay waxaa uu sheegay in Dastuurkan ay sameeyeen dad maslaxad gaar ah wata, kuwaasi oo bedelay sida uu yiri qodobbo badan oo ay soo sameeyeen Guddi madax bannaan oo muddo dheer ka soo shaqeynayay dastuurkan. “Dastuurkani kuma qorna Muqdisho in ay tahay caasimadda dalka Soomaaliyeed, Muqdishana waa meeshii mideyneysay Umadda Soomaaliyeed, haddii laga bedelana macnaheeda wuxuu noqonayaa in la kala dirayo Umadda Soomaaliyeed”ayuu hadalkiisa ku sii daray. “Haddii dastuurkani yahay mid la doonayo in shacabka Soomaaliyeed lagu xukumo waa in lagu qoraa caasimadda Soomaaliya in ay Muqdisho tahay, haddiise uu yahay dastuur dad gaar ah leeyihiin iyaga ayaa lagu xukumaa ee shacabka Soomaaliyeed shaqo kuma lahan” ayuu mar kale yiri Guddoomiyaha Gobolka Banaadir Maxamuud Axmed Nuur Tarzan. Guddoomiyaha Gobolka Banaadir oo ka gaabsaday in ay sameynayaan dhaqdhaqaaqyo dastuurka ka dhan ah ayaa wuxuu ku celceliyay in ay dalbanayaan in dastuurkan lagu qoro caasimadnimada Muqdisho, wuxuuna madaxda dowladda ka rajeeyay in ay arrintaas gartaan. Dastuurka loo sameynayo Soomaaliya oo aan weli la ansixin ayaa tan iyo markii qabyo-qoraalkiisa la soo bandhigay waxaa uu dhaliyay guux dadweyne iyadoo dad badan oo ka hadlayna ay siyaabo kala duwan uga hadlay. Qabyo-qoraalka dastuurka ayaa ansixintiisa lala sugayaa ergooyin ay soo xuli doonaan Oday dhaqameedyo Soomaaliyeed oo Muqdisho ku shirsan. Salaad Iidow Xasan (Xiis), Hiiraan Online

Wasiirka Dastuurka Soomaaliya Mudane Cabdiraxmaan Xoosh Jabril oo ka hadlayay hadalo kasoo yeerey Dad ku andacoonay in dastuurka lagu daro in Muqdisho tahay caasimada Soomaaliya ayaa sheegey in qolyahaas ay fidmo abuurayaan, Wasiirku wuxuu kaloo sheegey in shaqada loo direy Odoyaasha ay tahay labo qodob oo kaliya oo ah soo xulid Ergooyinka Ansixineysa Dastuurka iyo Iney soo Xulaan Xildhibaanada, lakiin ka hadalka Dastuurka, hadii wax laga saxayo ama eed laga keenayo waxay u taal buu yiri Ergooyinka lasoo xulayo. AUDIO http://puntlandi.com/?p=37614

Abwaan;848924 wrote: loool...Maaddeey, ma isku ciyaaraynaa? Kelli-Asaayle iyo Biyaha badda maxay kala yihiin? Marka is the best because it is not far from the capital, farmland and the ocean. It has a good weather too...! I would like to establish a business on the sand dunes if the future goverment will allow that. A reasonable one that is beneficial to both myself and the community. :D:D:D, for some reason I laughed hard here. :D:D:D:D

Haatu;848876 wrote: I thought this programme was shut down because the UN opposed it? It was shut down this month, the reasons are unknown. It was funded with $2 million dollars a month, over a half of the intended trainees finished their training and were deployed. Given Puntland’s ongoing territorial dispute with the neighboring province of Somaliland, some fear a worst-case scenario in which Farole uses a well-trained anti-piracy force to his own end. The PMPF amounts to “an independent private army” for Farole, says the U.N.’s Bryden. Matt Bryden is a pro-Somaliland UN official. He's married to a Somalilander and possess the fake passport of the region. He has many times professed support for the recognition of the region. Read about the controversies here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Bryden#Controversy It looks like some people were uncomfortable with the programme even though it yielded noticeable results.

Your obsession with Abdullahi Yusuf is a bit troubling since he hadn't ruled in Puntland for quite some time.

The prisoners don’t have uniforms, and only some have shoes. Many wear filthy T-shirts and an ankle-length garment wrapped around their waist that resembles a sarong (called a ma-awis in Somali). Inside the main yard, a young man with a bulging, round belly stands up and announces in English: “My name is Ahmed. I will try to speak to you.” He complains that the toilets aren’t clean, the living quarters are overcrowded, and the cells are crawling with insects. He pulls aside another prisoner with a protrusion on his head and implies he was injured by the guards. On a tour, I’m not shown the condition of the cells or the part of the prison set aside for Al-Shabab inmates. Those men are “a virus,” says the warden. “If we let them mix with the rest of the public, they can transmit the virus to the rest of the population.” I do get to meet Abshir Abdillahi, the Somali who is widely credited with founding today’s pirate industry. He more commonly goes by his nickname, Boyah. At 6-feet-6, he towers above me. He’s dressed in a floral blue-and-violet shirt, wears designer sunglasses and by all appearances, has the run of the place. At one point, he leaves an administrative office in a huff, refusing to grant an interview unless he’s paid. Before he was caught, Boyah often operated out of the port city of Eyl, far from the reaches of Mogadishu. Eyl is now in the hands of the PMPF. “It was the first place where pirates started,” says Farole. “But now we clean it up.” Source: The Daily Beast

The Daily Beast http://dissidentnation.com/to-beat-piracy-the-world-outsources-to-somalias-puntland/ From the vantage point of a desert airstrip that serves as an airport, the Somali town of Bosaso could be an exotic beach resort. Breezes carry scents of the sea, and the small port on the horizon shimmers against the pastel blue Indian Ocean. The closer we get to town, however, the more the reality of Bosaso comes into focus. Misspelled signs along the dirt road advertise foreign brands like “Marlboro” and “Nokia Telecon.” Shacks of cardboard, wire, and corrugated metal look like they’d be blown away in the next storm. This is Somalia, one of the most lawless places in the world, a country that has lacked a functioning government for more than 20 years. In that time, Somalia’s shores and waters have been overrun by powerful outlaw-entrepreneurs—otherwise known as pirates—who menace key trade routes, take hostages with near impunity, and at times collaborate with al Qaeda’s increasingly influential local affiliate Al-Shabab. Since 2007, the U.S. government has spent nearly half a billion dollars propping up African Union troops in Mogadishu and paying the salaries of the security forces affiliated with the weak transitional government there. None of that seems to have made much of a dent in the $7 billion piracy business. Here on an otherwise barren stretch of flat and rocky earth, a band of outsiders has launched an experiment to succeed where others have failed. Funded by the United Arab Emirates—where piracy threatens a massive shipping industry—and staffed by independent security contractors from South Africa and elsewhere, the two-year-old Puntland Maritime Police Force (PMPF) is building what could be the country’s first, dedicated pirate-catching machine: a highly skilled coast guard and state police for the semiautonomous Somali province of Puntland. If the PMPF succeeds, it could prove a model for unconventional methods to expand the reach of weak governments. Rather than an occupying military swooping in to sweep out the pirates from their coves, for-profit contractors are teaching locals the art of counterinsurgency. But if the PMPF fails, say some outside observers, these same contractors could be training one side in the next round of Somalia’s interminable civil war. A representative for the government of the UAE declined to comment. “This project … is the largest externally supported training program in Somalia,” says Matt Bryden, the coordinator of the United Nations group that monitors weapons sanctions here. “It changes the balance of power in Somalia in a way that other foreign assistance does not.” “When recruits arrive, ‘they are in rags, they are underfed, they don’t have any clue whatsoever of what entails.’” When I toured the Puntland facility in February, temperatures hovered around 90 degrees Fahrenheit. Summer days can top 110 degrees, forcing the officers to sleep on the beds of their trucks in the hopes of catching an ocean breeze. An eight-foot wall surrounds the compound, and inside are neat rows of tents and shipping containers that have been converted into administrative offices and armories. There is a desalinization plant, shooting range, communication satellite dish, gym, wastewater-recycling facility and one of the most advanced emergency rooms in the country. For most of the Somali recruits, it’s their first taste of military training. When they arrive, “they are in rags, they are underfed, they don’t have any clue whatsoever of what entails,” says Gert Kruger, a stout South African who has fought in Afghanistan and worked on security in various mines, and now heads the training program at PMPF. He says that for every 500 recruits, only 120 make it through the 17-week training. Most don’t even make it through the first hurdle: running 3.5 kilometers in 20 minutes, followed by 20 push-ups and 50 sit-ups. Abdullah Elmi, who is a lieutenant in the new PMPF from Bosaso, said when he finished high school, he couldn’t find a job. Then he heard a radio ad about the PMPF. “Somalia for the last 20 years, there has been no security,” he said through a translator. “I want to chase pirates from our sea and make our land more secure.” Puntland was chosen as the PMPF’s base in part because it’s one of the main pirate hubs, but also because the region is considerably more secure than the rest of the country. Puntland’s president, Abdirahman Mohamud Farole, says he has actively sought help in fighting pirates. During my visit to Somalia, I attended a ceremony at Puntland State University, where Farole presided over an event with Somali President Sharif Ahmed and other officials of the Transitional Federal Government in Mogadishu, who had gathered to negotiate a new framework for a Somali constitution. As the dignitaries arrived, soldiers in camouflage fatigues and red berets performed rifle drills. A military brass band played, accompanied by drum majors clad in loose-fitting red shirts with frilly silver epaulettes. A man with the honor guard asked a film producer in my entourage for a tip. He was refused. Afterward, the various leaders posed for photographers on a raised dais covered in red carpet; Farole flanked by the turquoise, white and green Puntland flag, and Ahmed by the Somali flag. Given Puntland’s ongoing territorial dispute with the neighboring province of Somaliland, some fear a worst-case scenario in which Farole uses a well-trained anti-piracy force to his own end. The PMPF amounts to “an independent private army” for Farole, says the U.N.’s Bryden. Others worry that there’s no governmental oversight of the for-profit contractors. In his book, The Pirates of Somalia, Jay Bahadur tells the story of a former Puntland president who hired a British contractor, Hart Security, to create a force to protect local waters from illegal fishing. In 2002, Hart Security lost the contract to a new company, Somcan, which dissolved in 2005. Some of the Somalis trained as coastal police were out of jobs, and reportedly went rogue. A 2008 report by Chatham House, a British think tank, quotes the skipper of a hijacked Russian tugboat saying that several of his captors were former members of the units trained by Hart and Somcan. Since 2011 the Bosaso operation has essentially been run by a Dubai-based contractor called Sterling Corporate Services. A lawyer representing Sterling, Stephen Heifetz, said, “The company has been transparent and compliant with the letter and the spirit of U.N. Security Council resolutions and other relevant laws.” Still, there have been missteps. In April, an officer was shot and killed by a trainee for reportedly accusing some soldiers of using the force’s vehicles to go into town and purchase khat, a narcotic that is chewed throughout the Horn of Africa. “It was a tragic but anomalous incident,” says Chris Grove, the project manager for the Bosaso base. “It is the only such event to occur in over a year of training under the most risky, difficult circumstances in the world.” Grove says the base has since tightened its screening process for recruits “and taken other steps to reduce the likelihood of a repeat incident.” Supporters of the PMPF say Bryden’s criticism is unfair in part because the U.N. itself has urged Puntland and other Somali provinces to develop just this kind of counterpiracy force. And in an interview, Farole told me he would turn over command of the PMPF to a central Somali government when his country “agrees on a constitution which determines how power and resources are shared.” For its part, the PMPF points to early successes, including arresting 11 alleged pirates in the town of Hafun in May and establishing a base in Eyl, a former hub for Puntland pirates and the hometown of Farole. It has also overseen relief efforts. In one recent mission, officers rescued 13 women and children stranded in a shipwreck. Another 33 people are still missing or presumed to be drowned. In the nearby town of Qaw, Grove and his men rebuilt a schoolhouse that was wrecked in a hurricane. As for the captured pirates, they often end up at a U.N.-built prison some 20 minutes from PMPF headquarters. To get there, I’m transported in a Toyota Forerunner with a driver, a translator, a documentary filmmaker, and a former special-forces officer. An escort truck trailing us carries four guards armed with AK-47’s. Along the way, my translator helpfully tells me that I wouldn’t want to make the trip on my own. “If they see a white boy walking around,” he says of the local pirates, “that’s money.” The translator has spent more time in America than Somalia since the central government fell 20 years ago, and says he doesn’t feel entirely safe himself. He asks me not to use his name for fear that Islamist insurgents will seek retribution against him for helping a foreigner. The first thing I see after passing through the prison’s iron gates are two black cauldrons of rice and stew simmering over a burning pile of branches and sticks. Not far beyond that, a faint smell of urine prevails. The warden, Shura Sayeed Mohammed, a lean, tall man who wears tan fatigues and a dark green beret, presides over 270 prisoners. In the past year, Mohammed says, the American military has turned over 16 captured pirates to the local authorities, who have handed them to traditional courts, who in turn have given them to him. A record of the prison transfers is kept in a rusted file cabinet in the warden’s office, he says. A handwritten chart on a wall nearby tracks when prisoners arrive and when they leave.