Ameenah, thank you for posting the poem. I think the 'Dood-wanaag' thread is on-going. It is currently documented in Somalitalk website. A host of young composers are contributing to it. Its the Deelleey of our time.

^^^ Good hunting bro. Ameenah iyo Garab, I'll try my best.

Caaqil: I know you are an Economics student, so sxb, can you suggest an economic development programme (Model) for a country like Somalia? A country that has to start literary from the scratch? I would also like to ask the same of all other thoughful nomads. PS: Maybe a platform for progressive Somali thought would be needed. A platform that acknowledges genuine thinkers and helps anyone who comes out with plausible approaches, theories and breakthroughs. Instead of objecting each other's thoughts and opinions, maybe it would be worthwhile to explore them and if possible give a helping hand to each other's in buidling on these thoughts to kickstart a wealth of knowledge. It is good to read foreign books only if they assist one to develop his/her own views and thoughts. Thank you in advance.

Alle-ubaahne, shukran for the link brother. Viking, I wrote about the meaning of ‘integrated individuals are those who study’ and how relevant the phrase is to the new report's suggestions. And in a nutshell nothing was misunderstood. You are right, I didn't even try to write about definitions again. I have done it once and I thought that was enough.

Raami, it seems many things are moving in your post with the school bus. Even your location: London is moving, where are you heading to amigo? Somehere sunny?

J11, I have always known these two words to mean quite different things. Integrated individuals are those who study, work, pay taxes and follow the laws of their adopted countries as long as it doesn't interfere with their own beliefs (which they haven't abandoned even after migrating), just like the posters here on the forums. Viking, in writing the above quote, you have raised very crucial points in regards to the ‘concept of integration’. In order to respond fairly to you, I will group the points in the following categories: Education, Employment, Tax, and Law and order. However, I will Insha-Allah try to give you my personal opinion on one of these issues you have mentioned, which is Education. I will argue that the two terms 'Integration" and "assimilation" are similar, in the sense that stretched- or compulsary integration leads to assimilation. On Education When you say ‘integrated individuals are those who study’, it could only mean that these individuals are the only ones who have access to educational institutions, through the opportunities provided by integration. If that is what you mean, then, fair enough – it’s understandable. However, what seems to puzzle me about the notion of integration - as is currently portrayed - is its paradoxical nature. The paradox here lies in the definition of the ‘integrated individual’. For one to be considered fully integrated, he must study, work and many other things. So if I were to follow this criterion then it means that any Tom, Dick and Jaamac who attends a certain school is indeed integrated, and thus the need for one to integrate will seize to exist. Somehow, I feel that integration doesn’t stop at one attending an educational institution nor being happy with the educational system by which one is educated; but it seems aimed at the attitude and private culture of the individual – private liberty. It also wishes to determine which subject an individual should study or not. To give you an example: the Muslim high school students in Paris didn’t object to French educational system, rather, the French educational system objected to the private and religious rights of these kids, all in the name social integration. How they dress, the attitudes they have and even their private rights (as stated in liberal doctrines) were subjected to scrutiny. Another good example in regards to the subjects’ which Muslim students can study or not, a story of discrimination of these students has even been featured in one of the broadsheet papers in Britain. In this instance, Muslim university students were refused to study subjects such as Medicine. The problem with the notion of integration is not it’s initial request of Muslims to co-exist with other communities, but the furtherance of its other hidden motives. It is also an attempt to control every aspect of Muslim communities only but not other communities like Sikhs in the UK, who, unlike us aren’t so much scrutinized. As the last words on the issue of Education: we are already integrated and anything beyond that is out-right assimilation. In addition, let me give my analysis on some of the suggestions the report asks of us to adopt. In the first place the report says: “More efforts should be made in the field of Muslim education, employment and the promotion of a culture of dialogue between Muslim communities and the majority societies;†When you read the above suggestion, you maybe mistaken to think that it is a straightforward and noble suggestion. But if you read between the lines, it becomes clear that when they say “more efforts should be made in the field of Muslim educationâ€, what they really are doing is practically bring Muslims under the direct control o government appointed and trained educators that are these days called the Mus-Mods (Muslim Moderates). These Moderates are not by themselves independent. They come under the Chaplainry of given educational institution, who then dictate on what is acceptable and what is not. Every step of the way of the so-called Muslim educators (which include trained and certified Imam) and guiders must be approved by the Chaplain, to make sure that the they cannot influence any of the students in any religious way. This is what educational opportunities of integration are meant by. Even more disturbing, there are economic restrictions on these appointed puppets on budgets such as that which Muslims students are legally entitled to during the month of Ramadan. It is for this reason that this new report suggests: “Muslims should (not) accept money from Muslim governments or other extraneous sources;†What this implies is that “Muslims should (not only) accept†but also not send money back to their relatives and countrymen, even when it’s for genuine non-terrorist causes. It is this type of suggestion that had brought forth the closure of innocent firms such as Al-Barakaat. The intention is to de-link Muslims in the West from the rest of the Muslim Ummah. Once you economically curtail the connection between peoples, you have achieved “Disintegration from Islam and “Integration to Christian Valuesâ€. It is the curving of the Ummah into fiefdoms that will never pose any future threat. Russia had done exactly this way in the case of Chechens more than 50 years ago. Also, and most importantly, what happens to scholarship funds, which many Muslims studying in the west depend on? Are they to be abolished too? “Muslims should focus more on the issues facing them in the majority societies rather than on events occurring in their countries of origin;†While the Muslims are to “focus more on the issues facing them in the majority societiesâ€, what is the West doing to our origin countries? Attack them? Plunder them? “Muslims should act with more self-confidence and in support of Muslim rights by setting up media watch groups and human rights watch groups;†Fair enough. In the name of Human Rights, we shall set up ‘media watch groups. But what happens to our countries of origin? While we (Muslims of the West) are asked to look-away, how can we be sure the West is not using the excuse of (Western) Universal Human Rights, to perform regime change and in turn, kill in thousands our people, while claiming to civilize our savage (Women-Mutilating) and backward Islamic societies? A-ah, no can DO. Nomads, I am sure you get the drift. So I will stop here.

QL, If you have access to the academic search engine called Jstor and enter "Archaeological and Paleoenvironmental Research in Northern Somalia", you shall come across a useful article that contains maps and places where discoveries were made inside Somalia. But the research was stopped due to political reasons.

I must add that the reason why the term "assimilation" is said to have a connotation is because it is by a nature coercive process. The act of assimilating others is involuntary. While on the other hand, the term "integration" refers to voluntarily accepting the host or dominant culture. If, then, one chooses not to voluntarily accept a given culture, assimilation is the next step. Bear in mind that assimilation was once undertaken by colonial France on Algerians, while Britain employed another approach similar to integration. The overall result was the same (colonizing other cultures), regardless of whether it was done through coercion or achieved conscent of some sort. Example: Assimilation is like one being told 'We want to kill you; how we kill you remains our choice, because you have no option in the style of your death'. Integration is like being told 'We wish to kill you, but you have the luxury of choosing which way to die'. 'If you want, we can bury you with your shoes off or on'

Originally by Mutakalim: You see, the terms integration and assimilation are not, despite the the misinformed responses of others, synonymous. Originally by Alle-Ubaahne: assimilation and integration are nothing but the same words in literal sense of the whiteman's linguestic books! I agree with the latter. Because the definition of the terms "assimilation and integration" is as follows: assimilate • verb 1 take in and understand (information or ideas). 2 absorb and integrate into a people or culture . 3 absorb and digest (food or nutrients). 4 regard as or make similar. — DERIVATIVES assimilable adjective assimilation noun assimilative adjective assimilator noun. — ORIGIN Latin assimilare ‘absorb, incorporate’, from similis ‘like’. integration • noun 1 the action or process of integrating. 2 the intermixing of peoples or groups previously segregated. — DERIVATIVES integrationist noun. Source: Oxford Dictionary My agreement(s) with Alle-ubaahne's opinion were objective and his words had mirrored mine. So please keep your misguided assumptions to yourself. PS: I am a man far too genuine to operate with borrowed thoughts.

Mutak Drop the act and discuss the topic (if you can grasp it that is).

I have been warning about ethiopia possessing more power over Somali politics....now we have it! A year ago i said: The reasons of shipments of such a large number of Somalis only constitute what some call "a historical ideological war", which as a result would make more Somalis become adaptive to western values, and it is more likely that we would see many Somalis relating to western (christian)values, which creates a possible increase of ethio-sympathetics in Somalia. By the time many of us go back to Somalia, there surely would be a clash of ideology. What threats Ethiopia poses cannot be comprehended by one or two writtings, but hopefully I wish you see things from my my angle once. This process is successfully taking place with the aid of "Universal Human Rights" claims. Or what some writers refer to as: Savage-Victim-Savior model. This is the substitution of foundational principles and values of one culture with liberal principles and values, thus, dub that substitution universal.

Alle-ubaahne, you are a far-sighted brother. Maasha-Allaah sxb.

^^^ I am glad brother. Our literature is our national asset and the craddle of our civilisation. Its somewhat illusionary and short-sight'dness if one dubs you with reer-baadiyanimo. Anyone one who does so lacks the mental ability to grasp the fact that there are other parallel civilisations to that of shakespeare! PS: Nothing stimulates me intellectually than the wisdoms contained in Somali literature. On lack of Patience Shinbir duulis badan oo dhulkii, dagi aqoon waayey Kol unbuu libaax labadii daan, dalaq yidhaahdaaye Inay edebtu shay door ah tahay, baan isaga daayey

^^^ Afkaaga caano lagu-qabey Baashi. Ninkii Legend ahaayoow, wallee wad naga qarsoonayd balse mar hadaan dibada iskeentey, waa ragganimo loo baahanyahay. Tusaale gabay : Baa di da ninbaa ku la dey deya, dalna kaa ba dan e' 2-1-1 1-2-1-1-1-1-2, 1-1-2-1-1-1 First half line = 13 syllabus Second half line = 7 syllabus Total syll = 20. (maybe i counted them wrong !) Corrections welcome. Bear in mind that various poems will adapt defferent number of syllabuses so it maybe 21, 20, 23 ..it dependents on the classic poet's style. Remember in both semi-lines an alliteration of the symbolised by similar sounds must be used. In the poem I used as an example, the alliteration is "Da". Just sharing the little I know

Xaaji Baashi shall I add: On Liberty Hadaan Dhimano geeridu kolbay nolosha dhaantaayae Dhaqashiyo marbey kaa yihiin dharagtu xaaraane Nin dharbaaxo quudheed dugsaday dhaqashadeed maalye Dhashaadeey sugtaa xaajadaad dhowrataa abid e'

Randomly, I think: Language (words) is the imprisonment of a mind that is free - from secterianism, belief systems, wrongs and rights. Education is the very tool with which the enslavement of the mind is achieved. The thoughts of all individuals fall under dictated category of reality and myth. To know is to relate to something, and thus to a certain structure. The child - when speechless - is the epitome of pure and free living. As language is key to communication, education is key to thought corruption. Education has many types and the current type exmplifies one acceptance of life. Decontructing linguistic structures that control the outcome or pattern of our thoughts, can liberate human mind and thus promote harmony between man and nature. Well, atleast, I am thinking, the culprit - language - is a liar. It does not speak true of what I see, feel, sense or smell as real. When I see a camel, language makes me believe that the camel is in a desert! Not true, maybe the camel is in London zoo. Hmm! How can I see or convey what I see as real to you exactly as it is?

Nin Soomalai Ah Oo Ciraaq Lagu Af duubtay Iyadoo... Wararka ka imaanaya waddanka ciraaq ayaa sheegaya in woqooyiga dalkaasi lagu afduubtay wade gaari oo soomaali ah. Wariyayaasha ku sugan waddanka ciraaq ayaa sheegaya in ninkaasi soomaaliga ah la afduubtay ka dib marii gaari uu waday oo ciidammada mareykanka alaabo usiday lagu burburiyay deegaanka Xuwayja ee galbeedka magaalada Kerkuuk. Wali lama garanayo kooxda ninkan soomaaliga ah afduubatay laakiin waxaa sidiiba caadada u ahayd kooxaha muqaawamada ciraaqiyiinta laga filayaa in ay soo bandhigaan cajal video ah oo ka dhex muuqanayo muwaadinkaasi soomaaliga ah oo wali aan magaciisa la sheegin. Waa ninkii labaad oo soomaali ah ee lagu afduubto waddanka ciraaq tan iyo markii dalkaasi ay qabsadeen huwanta mareykanku hor kacayo. Dhowr bilood ka hor ayay ahayd markii kooxda altowxiid wal jihad ee uu hoggaamiyo ninka reer Jordan ee Abu muscab alzarqaawi ay dalka ciraaq ku afduubatay, muwaadin soomaali ah oo u shaqaynayay shirkad gaadiid oo laga leeyahay waddanka kuwayt, kaas oo markii dambena la iska sii daayay markii madaxwaynihii xilligaasi C/qaasim salaad xasan uu si naxariis leh kooxdaasi uga codsaday in ay ninkaasi sii daayaan, iyagoo tix galinaya dareenka shacbiga iyo dowladdii Somalia oo diiddanaa dagaalkii gardarrada ahaa ee lagu qabsaday waddanka ciraaq. Kooxda al towxiid wal jihad ee uu hogaamiyo abu muscab al zarqaawi xilligaasi waxay soomaaligaasi ku sii daysay dareenka shacbiga soomaalida oo ay sheegeen in ay dhammaantood la duuban yihiin walaalohooda ciraaq ee dalkooda la haysto, laakiin waxaan la ogayn sida kooxda ninkan afduubatay ay ula dhaqmi doonto. Haddii kooxda ninkan soomaaliga ah afduubtay ay tahay kooxda alzarqaawi oo hadda la baxday (saldhigga jihaadka ee Bilaadu Raafidayn) arrintu waxay noqon doontaa mid khatar ah noloshiisana rajo badan lagama qabo, waayo kooxdaasi, waxay muddo aan fogayn ka hor soo saartay bayaan ah in aanay sii dayn doonin qof kasta oo ay qabtaan isagoo la shaqaynaya ciidammada ciraaq xoogga ku haysta, dhalasho kasta oo uu haysto, arrintaasi oo ah mid ay ka dhabeeyeen ka dib markii ay dileen, ciraaqiyiin iyo carab fara badan oo la qabtay iyagoo mareykanka u basaasayay qaarkoodna ay gawaarida sahayda qaadda u kaxaynayeen. C/llaahi Khadar, Goobjoog, Muqdisho Source: Goobjoog.net

Raami iyo Raula, I think those who are relactant to support other Somalis, or other Muslims in that matter, are in their teenage years. Maybe we should wait till when they grow abit older. It maybe a certain phase that they are going through. That is what I thought.

By Layzie: This isn't about me....... ignore it. I sure will . Thankx for the advice!

Originally posted by J B: From what i heard .. Adhi Adeye IS populated and inhabited by kinsmen who belong to MIGHTY Mogadishu kinsmen. If the frontline doesent move either towards Las Anood or towards Buroa in the comming hours... We´ll have to dispatch Mogadishu Militia to SAVE our kinsmen. Maybe just Maybe that is what it takes to make peace up there. Who expected such results in a holy month as this? May Allah defuse this war.

Written By: Mr. 11 quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Rudy, not everyone is as visionary as you and as proud to be Somali as you and me! Some people still dont know who they're -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Who might the "somebody" be? How is it that you know so much about people, especially the ones you are referring to. YOu might be proud of your somalinimo and showing it at every chance you get, doesn't mean the next person isn't because you don't see it. --------------------------------------------------------- Lazie: You have doubts about your Somaliness? Huh? If yes, then, good on you, if not then, what is burning you? So my pride in Somaliness offends you now? And might I add, who are you for these people I refer to? Any who is not showing his/her Somaliness in the hour of need isnt really a Somali - he/she is something else. PS: It is only specific people who hot up under the color when one displays pride in his/her Somaliness. If 'these' specific people believe we should be ashamed of Somaliness, then, what they beleive in is nothing but nonsense. BACK TO THE TOPIC How are our striking fellow Somalis faring? Any achievements yet?

Rudy, not everyone is as visionary as you and as proud to be Somali as you and me! Some people still dont know who they're Good luck with these brothers and sisters staging the strike!

^^^ Lol Mobb. Mind you, its said that is the longest message for a presidential campaign, was it? "and I approve this message" - Lol so who was I watching for the last 4 minutes? A ghost speaking on your behalf? Back to the Topic Congrats to Red Sox fans .. 'the world champions'

Right. And men expected their new wives to be sawn up, otherwise, they'd give her back. Hence, why women perform the rituals..for men's expectations. DA, to be honest, no one has ever ask for our expectations. On the contrary, I personally prefer an un-FGMed bride. So this is a woman on woman crime, nothing to do with us - men. Just like black-on-black crime.