Originally posted by Viking: [QB] Abdi, I understand what you are getting at bro. But you still haven't responded to my initial question; since the decisions from Al-Azhar are not of any "value" (as you put it), which scholars (or institutions) do you suggest the contemporary Muslims look to? Also, in his fatwa, Sheikh ibn Baz said that the world is flat (a huge error), would that disqualify him as a scholar to follow if we were follow your logic? No he should not be disqualified, but we take only that which dont contradict the majority, it is ijma that counts and not the lonely sheep. And you should know bin baz took back this opinion when other scholar corrected him and he followed the jama(majority) as the prophet(saw) told us stick to the majority.

Originally posted by Viking: quote:Originally posted by Nur: Brother, We Ahlul Sunnah wal Jamaacah believe that our scholars are not devine, thus prone to make a mistake of judgement, as a control for this risk, we depend on the Quraan and the Sunnah as a check, if the scholar can defend his fatwa accordin g to a daleel from Quraan, we accept, if he cant, we simply dont, and that is the major difference between Sunnah and Shia in a nutshel. I have clearly showed from Shia literature what they believe, to the page number , author and book, brother Viking, If indeed thesed beliefs are found to be true in the Shia Madhab, do you think with your understanding of Islam that it can be a fourth Madhab? or part of Islam? Nur, They are not infallible. I agree with your logic bro, but do you think that the research you have done is more than what the scholars of Al-Azhar have done from 1959 and beyond? Don't you think that they went deeper into Shi'a doctrines than you did? Some Muslims (belonging to the four madhabs) view Sufis as heretics while others don't, isn't it simply the same case here too? We are all responsible for the choices we make in the end but we (people of SOL) aren't scholars and rely a lot of the research done by them. What we aim for in the end is to find out the truth. It was not fatwa from al-azhar as instetution it was the personal opinion of Shaltoot who was the head of al-azhar at that time. Al-tantawi the current head of al-azhar said recently that its ok for France to ban hijab, what do you say about that. Number two al-azhar don't teach shia madhab in there university which shows that its not recognized. Number three why do it take 1000 year for them to discover this fifth madhab? Number four is there anything from our great predecessors about this so coled fifth madhab? Its only wishful thinking to say that shia are recognized as fifth madhab its something never heard of before.

I think we should leave Og alone. She knows little about shiism she is an average girl who only follows the deen of hear parents and we shouldn't be hard on hear. I pray to Allah that he guides hear to ahlul-sunnah the light and way. A proverb says every tree is known by its fruit. 1400year Islamic history shows that the fruit of shiism is nothing but the shadow to that of ahlul-sunnah. Even when it comes to islamic science to this day shia did not classify one single Hadith. The farthest they came was when there scholar said that half of al-kafi is unauthentic, but which half? they are working on that.

Originally posted by NGONGE: quote:Originally posted by Abdi2005: quote: Originally posted by Viking: Nur, Do you think that the head scholar of Al-Azhar erred when a fatwa was announced in 1959 (which is unchanged till today) saying that it is allowed for a Muslim to be a follower of the Ja'fari madhab (Ithna Cashariyyah/Shi'a al-Cimaamiyah) ? Do you think that Sheikh Maxmud Shaltoot and all those who came after him are in the wrong? This fatwa is not of any value. This was made in time of arab nationalism and it was politically motivated fatwa. Al-azhar is not longer as it was before, we remember the words of al-tantawi the head of al-azhar about hijab ban in France. If al-azhar consider shiism it be legitimate madhab why don't they teach jafari madhab in al-azhar? its hypocrisy. Its really weird that after 1000year this is the best recognition shia hav to clime they are fifth madhab. What happened to our great scholars of islam? did any one of them recognized jafari madhab? NO All the debate about shiism among our scholar have not been whether to consider them fifth madhab or not but whether they are muslims or not and thats the plane fact if you study the works of our classical scholars. And the conclusion, in spite of all the waffle, is that they ARE Muslim. Or else, why would our ardent Sunni scholars and brothers allow these non-Muslims to set feet in Mecca? Some discussions are nauseatingly redundant and cause nothing but division and fetna. This is one of those discussions. It’s one and only aim is to prove that the Shia are deviants! Well, maybe they are. Maybe the Saudi government (and all the Muftis there) only allow the Shia to do the pilgrimage out of political pressure... I did not clime the conclusion was they are kaffir. I only wanted to emphasis to brother Viking that sens the debate about shiism have always been "are they kafir or extrem deviant" it is far fetched to clime that they are considered to be fifth madhab, something shia always have dreamed about.

Originally posted by Viking: Nur, Do you think that the head scholar of Al-Azhar erred when a fatwa was announced in 1959 (which is unchanged till today) saying that it is allowed for a Muslim to be a follower of the Ja'fari madhab (Ithna Cashariyyah/Shi'a al-Cimaamiyah) ? Do you think that Sheikh Maxmud Shaltoot and all those who came after him are in the wrong? This fatwa is not of any value. This was made in time of arab nationalism and it was politically motivated fatwa. Al-azhar is not longer as it was before, we remember the words of al-tantawi the head of al-azhar about hijab ban in France. If al-azhar consider shiism it be legitimate madhab why don't they teach jafari madhab in al-azhar? its hypocrisy. Its really weird that after 1000year this is the best recognition shia hav to clime they are fifth madhab. What happened to our great scholars of islam? did any one of them recognized jafari madhab? NO All the debate about shiism among our scholar have not been whether to consider them fifth madhab or not but whether they are muslims or not and thats the plane fact if you study the works of our classical scholars.

I'm really interested Og how did you became shia, because so far nothing intelligible has come out from you about shiism so I'm little curies about your story. Are you married with shia? or did you contract muta one time and want to feel it as legitimate thing. Please don't take it as personal attack because some people joint shia for this reasons. How, when and why shiism?

1.....Where were Shias when Prophet Mohamed(s.a.w)was there..Alive and kicking..I think he would categorically have answered some of their questions... There was no shia back then, they are shia of Ali(ra) later shortened to shia. 2.....are Shia Imaams more 'holier' that our prophet(s.a.w)..Why would they stay away from This world Like in 'Mahdis'..for so long that even our Prophet Mohamed couldn't? They believe only the last imam is living and is in ghaybah, they say he was the son of imam al-askari(ra) history say he did not have any son. Allah can make any one he wishes to live long but there is not authentic traditions mentioning about this imam who supposedly is living after 1000 year 3......Why are they refuting the Holy quraan..I think they didn't refute the Holy Quraan when The Holy prophet was there...Why now...? Im not familiar with this believe. If you mean about tahrif of quran then this believe is abounded by shia. The traditions claiming tempering of quran in shia books is so many that it would be like mutawathir. But they now only hold on the believe that the verses of the quran is not in correct order. 4....Why has Shia..never spread more than IRAN and some parts of India..Sunnis have spread more than them by far..It has bypassed Indonesia..Malaysia and Philipines..Does this show the spread of Truth over false...?I am sure 'TRUTH' spread by far.. In Iran it was death or accept shiism. For 1000 year they mostly followed shaafi madhab until the Safavidi took the power in Iran. Shia did not even manged to conquer one inch of land from non muslims, thats not all the shia where the enemy with in who helped the Mongols and crusades when they attacked the Islamic nation. 5....What kind of books do they ascribe to if they don't accept The Holy Quraan..?Do they have a different Quraan...?why didn't they say so when The prophet Mohamed was there... Shia have 100% the same quran as we. 6....Why do they classify the Sahabas as..Good and adversaries..when Sahabas were one united group during prophet's time...?Why now? Thats the work of jewish,persian,pagen influence on shiism all of them joint this sect to work inside islam. Shia hate Umar(ra) more then any other sahabi its because it was he who conquered Iran, so the iranian fire worshiper who joint this sect Incorporated this hatred. 7....Even if they are given the authority to Lead ISLAM...as they say they would have liked...would they still change the Holy Quraan and Hadeeth...I think they would have left it compact and same...And what about the prayers..why do they pray differently...?Why didn't they pray like so...when The prophet was there... The way they pray is not significantly different the from maliki madhab. But 3 time salat and putting small rock under sujuud thats big innovation. 8....Why did the birth place of the Holy Prophet never had many Shias..I mean(MAKKAH)..It was infact supposed to be the 'Centre' of Shia if I am not wrong...Why IRAN...now?If they claim anything to the Ahlul..bait.. There are many shia in eastern Saudi Arabia, but there center has always ben south Iraq and its where there holy shrines is. 10.....^^^^^My question above...did this have a relation with Christianity/Judaism which started in Jerusalem...and now controlled from The Vatican...(ROMAN EMPIRE)..Christians have no option but to accept orders from The Vatican..did we refuse orders from IRAN(PERSIAN EMPIRE) and continued with the Truth...? There is not doubt shiism was influenced by Persians more than any other groups. 11......was there some kind of political parties after The prophet's death...Which party was Shia..Did they lose the Elections... All sahaba unanimously agreed on abu bakr(ra). shia came to being after Uthamns death(ra). 12...Now what problems do they have with Sunnis..Why do they hate Sunnis..What brought about this disunity in ISLAM.... The hatred is from the influenc of majusi, jahudi and mushrikins who hided themselves under the name of loving ahlul-bayt. There is allot of traditions in shia books where the people they clime as there imams accuse them for being mostly hypocrites, lier, apostates. Here is one narration "Imâm Ja'far is reported as having said: No verse did Allâh reveal in connection with the Munâfiqîn, except that it is to be found in those who profess Shî'ism" and in another narration Ja'far is reported to have said: "No one bears us greater hatred than those who claim to love us(shia)." There is many more hadith that gives you information about the so coled shia of ahlul-bayt. And we know where the killer of Uthamn(ra) hided themselves and lets AS not forget Ibn saba(the jew) who cimed to be shia of Ali(ra). Evey single imam shia claimed to follow condemned them. The shi are responsible for the death of imam Husain(ra) and his grand son and have cosed allot of pain to ahlul-bayt, but allah was testing ahlul-bayt with this wretch group, may the peace of Allah be on them. 13....Could this be a plan to 'finish' ISLAM which didn't work fine...? That will be the conclusion of any one who studies shia history and there literatures 14...Why are they coming back to the fold of ISLAM now after 1200 Years later...?if they didn't prove themselves wrong.. Cajeeeeeeeeeb...No wonder we are seeing an 'Influx of Shia follower'...coming back to the main Branch of islam(SUNNI)...Come to Dubai and arabia..(for those Shias who came into contact with 'Real ISLAM')..and see them IRANIANS and other Shias..denouncing their Poltical party(Shiasm)coming back to the fold of ISLAM..they do regret...walahil cadhiim.... From what i see this sect is growing. Shia almost gain no converts from non muslims, they putt all there efforts and propaganda towords ahlul-sunnah.

maybe. But i realy doubt after tomorrow the only thing they remember will be the "somali" part. I'm afraid people will get negative picture because of hear unintelligible contribution :rolleyes: .

Very poor contribution. She even had to be corrected couple times for going out of topic, she seams to thing its right place to promote somaliland, its program about Africa's problem a serious topic. I don't thing she will be invited again.

It is difficult for thief to go unnoticed with a pall of money(maybe equal 100$)

I have video from my trip in 2000 to muqdisho. If some one is interested i will capture the video and put for download joust let me know. If other people have videos from somalia and want to share i can give them my username and password to my netpocket(10gb) so that he can upload the file and then every one can download.

Fyr do you have the 10 gb storage? Its very cool service from bredbandsbolaget i have friend in USA sending me video files, i gave him the program and my user name and password and you can login from any where to download and upload from the map

Dont you know netpocket only allows 10 downloads(10 gånger) after that the link doesnt work. can you putt the file on "delade filar" and give me the Användarnamn and Lösenord for that map "delade filar".

That was interesting discussion. Siciid-yare thats very true 95% of somali website is made that way. But its actually very popular internationally to make that way many non somali websites i visited are made this way. But the somali use this colspans to fill with links and flash or pictures the problem is they dont have any other things they can use for that place. Why we don't have contest in somaliaonline its forum are HTML enabled. All somali who know Little will tray to make a small HTML website.

Dastuurkii oo Arbaco Go’ay Khamiisna God Gelaya Ilaah baa mahad leh. Naxariis iyo nabadgelyo Nabi Muxamed korkiisa ha ahaato. Labo “professors†(Geeddi & Dalxa) iyo hal “President†( 3Ps) ayaa shalay dharaar cad dastuurkii la degsaday madaxa ka toogtay. Waxaa la filayaa in dastuurka madaxiisa inta “mudane†Geeddi goosto uu beri oo 12/05/05 Zenawi hor dhigi doono! Waxaa Zenawi laga filayaa inuu dhihi doono guuleyso Geeddi; geeddigana wad! Mar la sheegay in qofkii inta Khamiis dhinta Jimcana god gala uu janno galayo ayaa nin reer Mudug ahi wuxuu sheegay inuu saas damacsanyahay! Ma la yaab bey leedahay haddaad maqashaan nin reer Mudug ah oo raba in inta huwan soo geliyo Soomaaliya uu kaligiis wax kala xukumo? Raqda dastuurka waxaa iiga sii daran waqtiga loo qabtay in lagu dilo. Waxaa la sheegay in habeyn hore 10/05/05 inta korneylka iyo Geeddi u yimaadeen Shariif Xasan ay ku dhaheen beri waaberigii (11/05/05) shir u qabo xildhibaannada. Shariifka waxaa la sheegay inuu yiri shir waan qaban laakiin waxaan ka dhigayaa in la qabto 17/05/05 si qolyaha Soomaaliya ku maqani usoo xaadiraan. Laakiin labada nin waxay dhaheen waa in shir lagu qabtaa 12 saac gudahood. Shariifku wuxuu sheegay inuusan sidaas oo kale u shaqeyn markii cagojugleyni uga timid xagga C/hi. Horta xisaabta xildhibaannada waan ku wareeray. Waxay ku sheegaan 275 laakiin aniga waa igala badanyihiin. Haddee waxaa la yiri boqol kuwa gaara Xamar bay ku maqanyihiin; kontomeeyo kale oo Shariifku ku jiro oo jooga Nairobi ayaa la sheegayey oon kulankaas imaan; xeyn kale oo Bakool joogta oo Baydhabo weerar ku soo ah iyo 152 joogtay meeshii dastuurka lagu dilay. Haddaad sida dadku wax iskugu daro la isku daro waa ka badanyihiin 275. Waxaa la sheegay in 145 ka mid ah 152 xildhibaan oo shalay halkaas joogay ay u codeeyeen in ciidamo ka socda Ugaandha iyo Suudaan la keeno Soomaaliya sidoo kalana dowladdu sii degto Baydhabo iyo Jowhar inta Xamar laga islaaxinayo! Waxaa la sheegaa in Hal-abuur Sangub inta jacaylkii qabri gashay (riwaayaddii Qarbigii jacaylka) la arkay isagoo mar dambe jacaylkii xuud liqsiiyey (Xuud baa liqay Jacaylkii). Wariyayaashii riwaayadahaas dacaayadda u sameynayey waxaa laga sheegay iyagoo leh: jacaylkii uu shalay qarbiga dhigay buu maanta dilayaa oo xuud liqsiinayaa! Marka waxaan uga danleeyahay marba hadduu korneylku dastuurka dilayo waxaa la rabay inuu Khamiis dilo oo Jamce god dhigo si aan niyadda kheyr ugu heyno. Waxaa nasiibdarro ahayd in korneylku “xubnihii†baarlamaanka hortooda ka eedeeyey guddoomiyaha baarlamaanka isagoo ku heystay seddexda qodob ood maqasheen. Wuxuu yiri Shariifku isagaa jeebkiisa wax kala soo baxaya. Korneylka iyo Geeddi waxay istuseen haddii dastuurku dhinto inay dhaxlayaan dowladnimo! Laakiin waxay waayo-aragnimadu na tustay inaysan arrintu saas ahayn oo haddii la baalmaro waxii la isku ogaa inaan faa’iido iyo horumar la gaarin. Muslimiintu waxay qabaan inaan muslim iyo gaal isdhaxlin. Si Zenawi Soomaaliya u dhaxlo wuxuu sameystay dagaal-oogayaal ka amar qaata oo muslimiin sheegta iyo waddamo saaxiibo la ah oo uu tiisa ku fushado oo qaarkood muslimiin iyaguna sheegta. Ciidamada Zenawi waxay ku tunteen oo saxarada iskaga tireen kitaabka Qur’aanka Kariimaa markay Gedo qabsadeen. Waa sheekada hadda laga sheegayo Maraykanka inay Xabsiga Kuubba ku yaal ay sidaas oo kale yeeleen. Haddaa dadkii reer Afganistaan bannaanbaxyo ay arrintaas uga soo horjeedaan wadaan. Marka hadday Zenawi u toosto waa la arkin masaajid badan oo noqda meel ay waardiye ka galaan askar Amxaaro ah ama Ugaandha u dhalatay. Maxaan ka waday 3Ps? “Three Puppetsâ€. Awal baa dad hore soo qoreen haddaad aragtaan “Dr†ka carar iyagoo ku sheegay: dalkiis roge/dadkiis roge. Laakiin hadday rabto diintiis roge bay noqon kartaa. Dhimashadu ma dastuurka keliyey ku ekaan? Ma filayo. Madaxyo badan waxay ku go’i doonaan sidoo kalana dhiig badan ku daadan doonaa dagaaladan ka hilaacaya Bay iyo Bakool. Dhibta ugu badan waxay gaareysaa shacabka aan shuqul ku lahayn waxa isceyrsanaya. Marka waa Soomaali badan ha dhimato; ciidamo Suudaan, Itoobiya iyo Ugaandha u dhashayna ha yimaadeen. Nin Carbeed oo dagaalka aad u yaqiinay baa dagaalka ka sheegay. Soomaali ahaan wuxuu yiri: • dagaalku cabbaarkiisa hore waa gabar cas oo kale • oo quruxdeeda caalle kastaa dabocararo • ilaa uu dabku cartamo oo holucu cirka isku shareero • markaasay cajuusad noqotaa aan ninna cudduda ugu jirin • cirro leh, urkeeda laga cararo, dhunkashadeedana laga caago. Nin ka mid ah ragga gabaygaas loo tiirsho ayaa Cumar Binu Khidaab (RC) weydiiyey dagaalka. Ninkaas oo Camri Macdiiyakrib la oran jiray wuxuu yiri: markuu dabku oogmo oo dhudhumada la feyto waxay u dhammaataa ninkii ka daciifa dagaalka waxaana la gartaa ninkii ku samra. Marka dagaal-oogayaasha Xamar oo u qabay inay sheekadu ciyaartaas ku dhammaaneyso waxaan ku leeyahay: korneylkii isagoo huwantuu wadan jiray wata buu idin soo hayaa ee idinkey idin jirtaa sidaad yeelilahaydeen. Shalay korneylku wuxuu xabashi soo geshay Galdogob iyo Balanbale maanta waa Baydhabo, Belidoogle, Kisaamaayo,…, iyo Xamar. Dad badan oo wax qora waa u digeen Soomaali. Markii Soomaali badan ay Xamar iyo meelo kale ku soo dhoweeyeen Geeddi waxaan soo qoray maqaal ahaa (Geeddi: hadday Xamar igu soo dhoweeyeen, Anigu Xabashi ma kusoo dhoweynkaraa?). Jawaabtii Geeddi isagaa caddeeyey. Maqaalka waxaan uga danlahaa inaan cid la iska soo dhoweyn iyadoon la ogeyn waxay la socdaan. Marka Soo dhoweyntaad soo dhoweyseen wuxuu ugu abaalguday in inta dastuurka wax ka dilo oo Adisababa madaxiisa u qaado uu isaga iyo Amxaaro aad marka dambe Xamar ku soo dhoweysaan idinkoo la idin soo khasbay. cabdulwaaxid Khaliif cabdulwaxid@hotmail.com

1) Danjiraka Kenya u qaabilsan arrimha Soomaaliya Maxamed Cabdi Afey Dood wadaag ee TV-ga HornAfrik 2) Qeybta Labaad Dood wadaag, Su'aalo ay weydinaayaan dadka firsanaya tv & radio hornafrik <<<

146Mp's? how many times did we hear this kind of lies from A/Yusuf’s blind supporters. I remember the last lie made in 1 April about 160 mp's. This dudes are so desperate and big time lier's, the guys who goatherd are the same small pro ethiopian group who started the mischief in the parliament after they lost motion against ethiopia entering somalia.

Their is now hundreds Somali website and the number is increasing. Which 3 Somali websites do you think have best design(not information) write your list. My list 1) www.muqdisho.net (colorful and simple) 2) www.allpuntland.com (advanst with allot grafik images) 4) www.gedonet.com/ ( allot of table rw but still organized) I have noticed that almost all somali websites are divided in 3 colspans 2 small and one big in the middle.

http://www.allpuntland.com/news/news_item.asp?NewsID=3942 Very good and informative interview.

Originally posted by Duke_Valantino: [QB] The press release of the 160 MP's with six main points and recommendations It was only 60 PMs and not 160. The 60 Mps who came together are the same guys who voted for Xabashi to come to somalia but after they lost started to make mischief in the parliament, with other words its a bunch of big losers who came together. Its no surprise they particularly condemn Speaker of the Parliament Sharif Hassan.

Xildhibaan Xasan Abshir oo sheegay warkii uu shalay siiyey saxafada in ay ahayeen wararkii 1 Abriil oo ah maalinta Beenta Aduunka Xildhibaan Xasan Abshir Faarax oo ah gacanta midig ee Madaxweyne Cabdulaahi Yuusuf ayaa shalay siiyay saxaafada in ay shir laba maalin qaatay yesheen xildhibaana kor u dhaafaya 160 tasoo aysan jirin xaqiiqdiisa kadib markii ay goobta shirka saxafadahii goobjooga ka ahaa ay shegeen in ay joogeen goobta shirka 60 xildhibaan oo kaliya . Mana dhici karta 160 xildhibaan oo sax shirkooda noqon karin mid qarsoodi ah xaqna u leyihiin intaas hadii ay dhan yihiin in shir gudoonka shirka uu gudoomiya shirkooda lakiin runtii ma dhacin tirada saxda ah , mar wax laga weydiiyey Xasan Abshir warka uu siiyey shalay saxafadda ayuu yiri asagoo qoslaya miyadan ogeynina shalay in ay aheyd 1 Abriil oo ah maalinta beenta Aduunka,marka hadalkeyga waa kaas wana dareemi kartiin sida aan ugu aadanay maalintaasi . Si kastaba ha ahaatee waxaa moodaa shirkii laga sugayey na tiijada mid sii wiiqaya isuna badalay laba isbaheysi oo xoogan midba midka kale diidan yahay waxii ka soo baxana ay noqon karaan dagaal hor leh barakac iyo isnaceeb isir oo hor leh oo aad mooday in laga gudbayey xiliyadii danbe Dayniile.com

Originally posted by Duke_Valantino: ^^^ The above brother you dont even know the man's name let alone who controls the city. His name is Xabsade and not Xoogsade. Hes name is Xaabsade not Xabsade. And are you telling me shatigaduud controlled the city and Xaabsade captured from him?

Originally posted by Duke_Valantino: As ever you can not hide your clanish sentiment. Inda Cade attacking Baidoa and taking over must seem like a repeat of the "glory" days. However lets not kid ourself's the RRA will prevail for thhis is their land. The people of south will also prevail and reclaim, Marka, Barav and the rest. This is my prediction. The government is needed to deal with criminals like Inda Cade and other's. Thats why Geedi and President Yusuf are the only hope to beat, the drug lords, fake religious wadaads and so on. Everything is moving ahead as planned..lol I really doubt you will understand how childish you arguments sounds, time to grow up man. It was Xaabsade who controlled the city and he still douse after Shatigaduds attempt to pave the way for A/yusuf.

There are two sides to every story. The propaganda from the other side is not much different then when Morgan tried to take over Kismayo. As barre Hirale controlled kismayo so douse Xaabsade over Baydhabo. And every one knows who was Morgans biggest supporter(A/Yusuf,Ethiopia). This time their is no big secrecy A/yusuf want to be rid of Xabsade who opposed almost to every thing that comes from A/yusuf and hes plan for Baydhabo. A/Yusuf sends Shatigaduud to pave the way for hes new capital. Xaabsade played big role in the defeat of Morgan. Xoogsade, Yusuf Indacade and Dahir Aways all of them gave military support to Bare Hiiraale. Now xogsade have the support of Barre Hiiraale, Yusuf Idhacade and Dahir Aways while Shatigaduud have the support of the man who send him and Ethiopia.

Im using Mini PC AMD 2500+ with 512mb memory and 200gb sata harddisk and DVD-RW 16x, my monitor is 17" LCD from ViewSonic. If some one wonder why i have 200gb harddisk its for downloading DVD movies and video editing.