Heh. You're changing the subject.

You hamstrung me with the use of the word 'traitor'. Like I said, all victors wrote their own history and it’s quite hard to find one that you would call a ‘traitor’ now. Check out the history of Egypt, Saudi Arabia and even Iraq.

Nomadique, I'm not that rude. I was criticising the actual argument over Somaliland. It's sixteen years too late.

^^^ I once had a friend who was young, silly and irresponsible. He shacked up with a girl and they did naughty things. She later gave birth to their baby daughter without him marrying her. Now the daughter is sixteen years old and some people keep on saying bad things about the way she was conceived. The mother and father swear that they were secretly married and that the baby was legitimate but not many people believe them. Of course, none of this matters really, the girl is HERE and she’s been in this world for the past sixteen years. Her origins and how she was conceived have become nothing other than simple housewives’ gossip. What do you think you’re achieving by engaging in this meaningless debate? Ps Though I think the girl is pretty I can’t recognise her as the daughter of her own daddy without being shown a stamped birth certificate from the powers that be. But then again, I really don’t know that girl and don’t have as strong an emotional bond with her as those that grew up with her or brought her up.

Xanthus, You're starting to get emotional on me. This is a hypothetical situation. Mr Yusuf has not won everything yet. He still has to run the country and ensure that all civil institutions are in place and working perfectly. He still has to have a valid, functioning and competent parliament in place (those guys have not done zilch since they’ve got those jobs). He still has to deal with a million and one administrative issues and he still has to work on the political side of things. It’s a huge task that I personally doubt he and his henchmen can achieve, not because I question the ability of the man. Because love him or hate him, he really stands heads and shoulders above any other rivals but it’s because I don’t think any of the people working with him are good enough for the jobs they have. Duke can sing the praises of the TFG but even Duke would tell you that most of those that are working with Mr Yusuf are incompetent oafs. My outlook on this is purely political with the least amount of emotion thrown in. If Mr Yusuf prevails then the history books will acclaim him as a great Somali leader. Granted that it’s a big IF but the bit about history is really as straightforward as that. Neither Iraq nor Afghanistan compare to the Somali situation.

Geel Jire, No. Not like President Siyad Bare. He lost remember.

Ah! Yet another pointless debate. I refuse to take this seriously unless and until you throw the clan issue into the mix. I'm not the world's biggest expert on Somali clans. In fact, back in the days when I first was forced to mix with Somalis, I once unwittingly threatened to beat up an entire sub-sub-clan! The misunderstanding was owing to the fact that when two people fall out and someone reports that fall out to a third party, they would say that one particular clan had a disagreement with another. But, of course, the beauty of Somali clans is that they're not designated some clear identifiable names. Instead, they're called Cali Moxamed, Cumar Cawar or Cabdullahi Curyaan! Now, when some random Nomad came to me and informed me that Xasan Xabiibleh beat up my young brother how in the world was I supposed to know that this was the name of a clan and not a single person? I tell you, I almost caused a diplomatic incident as I tried to attack my brother's assailant outside the mosque (just as the old men were coming out). As is typical with Somalis, everyone tried to intervene as I shouted all sorts of threats and swore that I shall not rest until I put this Xabiibleh's nose in the mud. A couple of old men got really agitated and dared me to do it (I simply thought they were the father and uncle of the cowardly Xabiibleh). Luckily, they found someone that could speak Arabic and explain the whole thing to me. But my actions seemed to be strong enough to warrant a sit-together between my clan and cowardly Xabiibleh's clan (or shall I say the Xabiibleh clan? The guy's real name turned out to be a boring old Abdi). At any rate, that day I learned that whenever one talks about Somalia and not include the clans in those discussions I'll do well to ignore their rants as nothing but empty talk and hot air. So, come on, tell me what clans fuel your love for Islamnimo or Somalnimo. Disclaimer: any resemblance between the clans herein and real clans existing or otherwise is purely coincidental.

Nayruus, The 'SNM Gangs' you're talking about are very old men now. You want to fight a dad's army (I'm trying to stay with my own theme here)? Shame on you, man, shame on YOU.

^^^ Looks like we'll just have to wait and see, saaxib. Xiin's reply there is perfectly true.

Here we go again. I could just imagine the sort of replies you will get..how about a little something like this: "I have, myself, full confidence that if all do their duty, if nothing is neglected, and if the best arrangements are made, as they are being made, we shall prove ourselves once again able to defend our homeland, to ride out the storm of war, and to outlive the menace of tyranny, if necessary for years, if necessary alone. At any rate, that is what we are going to try to do. That is the resolve of His Majesty's orphans (as you would call them)-every man of them. That is the will of the Somaliland Parliament and the nation. The Somaliland nation and 'others', linked together in their cause and in their need, will defend to the death their native soil, aiding each other like good comrades to the utmost of their strength. Even though large tracts of Somalia and many old and famous parts have fallen or may fall into the grip of the "Gestapo" and all the odious apparatus of "Nazi" rule, we shall not flag or fail. We shall go on to the end, we shall fight in Xamar, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our land, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender, and even if, which I do not for a moment believe, this land or a large part of it were subjugated and starving, then our refugees beyond the seas, armed and guarded by the dahabshiil Fleet, would carry on the struggle, until, in God's good time, the New World, with all its power and might, steps forth to the rescue and the liberation of the old." With apologies to Sir Winston Churchill...

^^^ True. But if he manages to pacify Somalia (by force) and rule it, then, as was the case with a million bad men before him, history will be written by the victor (i.e Mr Yusuf).

^^^ Welcome back, boss. Is that what you've been away with? Should I dig out my best suit or just steal Johnny B's little black book and pass it on?

Originally posted by Garaad Canood: Saxib, my country is Soomaaliya, The article is solely the opinion of the writer; it doesn’t reflect my own opinions I don’t always post articles that reflect my views, like some SOLers who all they know is propaganda, I read what others think, and sometimes I share articles wrote by those who don’t support my views This article is for northwest Somalis (ee ayagu isku bixiyey Somalilanders) Somehow I knew you would miss the point You don't accept Somaliland as a nation yet here you are posting an article that clearly does so! war es dheeb ban ku edhi. It's obvious that you have a soft spot for the idea but your unresolved complaints are stopping you from giving in to your feelings. Or else, you're just mad (no offence, think the whole thing through).

^^^ Glad to see that you finally accepted Somaliland as your nation and are trying to point out the faults of the government. Jokes aside, don't you think your posting of this article is a bit silly?

Nayruus, We're not sure if it is fact or fiction though. Other than your argument here I don't think anyone else has discussed this issue before. It's just too farfetched in our Waxa la yedhi obsessed society. Then again, I suppose you just started the ball rolling...

During the recent fighting in the capital I almost believed that the story of Somalia was over. Almost burned my spare blue flag. I'm glad I didn't. Better dust it off and have it ready to wave once I see all of Burco doing that. For now though, it'll have to stay under my bed alongside my other national flag.

^^ Why is it that in those six years nobody other than you has noticed or commented on this dubious fact? At any rate, I believe Silaanyo to be too old for the job of Somaliland president. The rest of the thread is not worth commenting on.

Originally posted by Khalaf: quote:Originally posted by NGONGE: Things have really never been better for those countries. And they have never been worse for Muslims in the west. ^^^do u just want to take the opposite train of thought here yaa NG come on now. I get the feeling that ppl think Muslims are “inferior” compared to mainly the “powerful” dawgs of the world no? Hmmmm, if Muslim world is backwards then who is enlightened and forward? With all dis technology, sciences, and wealth accumulated most humanity is in poverty, tens of millions die of diseases, not to mention how the good technology of the enlightened western man since WW1 has killed, gassed, shocked n awed, and destroyed the lives of hundreds hundreds of millions of people throughout the world. But hey that’s progress I guess. Erm, what's your point? You quote me there yet seem to be replying to something entirly different! FOCUS, son. The point, I look around me and see every last child discussing Islamic problems and being able to instantly obtain a valid fatwa or information on any given topic. I see the message of Islam being spread to all corners of the world. I see the problems within Islam being discussed by all and sundry. This is not at all what I would call DECLINE.

Liverpool will score Benitez will approve They'll lift the cup And dance all summer.. More animated images of liverpool here

Decline? The Muslim world is on the rise today, people. Forty years ago every last corner of the Muslim world was occupied and it was not only the 'corrupt' leaders who were to blame, every Muslim had a hand in that shame. Today, most Muslim countries are free (save your conspiracy theories) and choose to do things they way they want. The fact that they’re backwards, primitive and self-loathing is their problem and nobody else. Time to switch off this tired old record of decline and what not. Things have really never been better for those countries. And they have never been worse for Muslims in the west.

^^^ Can't I have a go at Val in peace please? Do you really have to show me up like this and allow her to get away with her modern-girl shenanigans? ps New name? What's the old name?

Wishes and facts are two different things. I wished to have stayed in a hotel. But I never did. Can't abandon tradition you see.

You say 'find a somali to crash with' as if that's something that's hard to do! Tsk. Modern girls and their modern holidays.

Originally posted by Valenteenah: What I see... Darling Harbour, Sydney, from my hotel window. Simply breathtaking! :cool: You went to Sydney and stayed in a hotel? A HOTEL! Are you at all Somali, woman?

^^ No mention of Somaliland here! Do you think he finally gave up on the dream? Good article. But I wonder if his remorse will go far enough as to allow him to accept someone from those clans as a brother-in-law?