NGOONGE: No doubt that this is good propoganda but you know the Brits can not recognise Somaliland without the US and the UN and the AU would not allow this because of the many other more tribal nation wannabe areas across the continant. Anyhow I want to get the opinion of the secessionists Al Shabaab supporters.

Emperor: Adeer they get personal because they have nothing on their side. They have vacated the moral highground. Now we are led to belive the poor Mothers went on TV and stated falsehood about their missing children because they got paid. It is the Mothers fault now. They must be punished for speaking out huh. Shame on you all.

^^^I care deeply about the NW dear. And I care to hightlight that the snake you was rasing for the purpose of hurting the south has come back to bite you.. Anyhow why cry to old Britian I thoguht you was an "independent" nation? As for child stories, did I writte this in the Guardian and I thoguht we belived everything we read and heard on the British press. Anyhow did AL SHABAAB bomb you>? and what are you going to do about it. Norf, Red anyone

AfricaOwn: Adeer Al Shabaab have killed more people from Somaliland than Puntland, and you can do nothing about it, not even get angry least they bomb you again. We have dealt with these folks before, and are at small scale war with them. They bombed your "capital" and all you can do is deny it, so who is afraid?

Garyaqaan* , Old friend long time, I am just trying to direct old Xiin out of the hole he has dug himself in. The man wanted to be a hero for the likes of Red/ Red is a secessionist who pretends to be a religious warrior. He wants to unite the Islamic Ummah but divide the Somali house. Not much sense in trying to educate such folks. The other things about these fake Mujahids is, they want to send other peoples kids, while they are too afraid to go themselves. Anyhow I am here to educate any, secessionist, Al kebaab follower. No insults and we will keep up with the rules of this site.

Secessionists are indeed confused.. The above report was posted on Somaliland.org... Its not Al Shabaab, is it not

Britain is leaving once-stable Somaliland to the mercy of al-Shabaab Islamist militants November 13th, 2008 Jeremy Sare guardian.co.uk, Thursday November 13 2008 10.00 GMT Article history The co-ordinated suicide bomb attacks in Somaliland’s capital Hargeisa two weeks ago shattered more than a decade of stability. Yet the despite the continuing threat hanging over this former British protectorate, the British government will not act to properly protect the fledgling democracy. Since tearing itself from a bloody union with the violent southern half of Somalia, Somaliland to the north has been an oasis of democratic hope in a turbulent region (about 8,000 people are estimated to have been killed in southern Somalia in the last 18 months). The car bombings, which killed about 30 people (including two UN officials), served as a bitter reminder to the Somalilanders, if one were needed, of their proximity to the pit of spiralling violence and their own vulnerability of sliding back into it. There were also lethal explosions in the semi-autonomous regime of Puntland. The international community is watching passively as the terror and violence erupt again. There is no shortage of international condemnation for the attacks, including from the minister for Africa, Lord Malloch-Brown, but no real practical help is being offered. As the former colonial power, Britain has a particular responsibility to the 3.5 million Somalilanders. “We need two levels of support,” says Abdi Karim, head of Wales Somaliland Communities Link. “First, capacity-building and training of police and security services. Second, humanitarian support for the hospitals, if there are further attacks”. Somaliland does not qualify for specific aid and development, let alone additional security support, because it is not recognised as sovereign by the UN. It has been effectively an independent country since 1991, but without diplomatic recognition there can be no support programme; the result is extreme poverty and a chronic lack of defence infrastructure. Michael Walls of Somaliland Focus (UK) blames “a lack of willingness on the part of many international actors to sufficiently recognise… both state and civil society remain enormously under-resourced”. The bombings in Somaliland were most likely a concerted effort to curtail the country’s third presidential election to be held next March; voter registration has ceased in the ensuing security clampdown. There is a strong suspicion across the region the group responsible for the atrocities was al-Shabaab an extreme Islamist militia which now effectively controls the southern Somali port of Kismayo and parts of the capital, Mogadishu. They practice an extreme form of sharia law and have now turned their spiteful gaze to the harmonious north. They announced their murderous intent in 2006 when one of the leaders of the Islamic Courts Union, Sheikh Dahir Aweys, promised publicly “to send 30 young martyrs to carry out explosions and killing of the Jewish and American collaborators in the northern regions”. Al-Shabaab is considered by many governments to be, at least ideologically, if not materially linked to al-Qaida. Since they overran Kismayo in August, al-Shabaab leaders have restored order. But then began the wholesale violent suppression of the people, particularly women, under their perverse interpretation of Islamic law. To gauge the degree of fundamentalism within al-Shabaab, you need look no further than the stoning to death of 13-year old girl a few days ago in Kismayo. The circumstances of Asha Ibrahim Dhuhulow’s killing could hardly be more brutal. She was first raped by three men but was condemned as “an adulterer” by Al-Shabaab leaders. An anonymous eyewitness told the BBC she was dragged to a stadium weeping. She was buried up to her neck before 50 men stoned her in front of a 1,000 strong crowd. The international community seems resigned to this institutionalised barbarism and routine human rights abuses in Somalia. But there has been some hint from the British government they would like to help Somaliland but are held back by the “technicality’ of not having recognised sovereignty - notably by, chair of the All-Party Group for Somaliland Alun Michael MP, Britain’s support would risk offending the sensibilities of Italy and a couple of African Union countries which oppose their independence. But the counter-argument to an independent Somaliland can be captured in one word: “Somaliweyn’. In essence it means a call for a Greater Somalia by uniting all the Somali peoples who currently live in southern Somalia, Somaliland, Djibouti, eastern Ethiopia and the north-eastern province of Kenya. Somaliweyn is nothing more than chauvinistic patriotism which defies long-established international boundaries and flies in the face of political reality. Reports from Hargeisa in recent days describe a tense city still in shock and fearful of the next strike from al-Shabaab. It is time Britain acted to offer effective security support and intelligence to Somaliland.

Madaxa Sirdoonka Mareykanka oo cadeeyay in Alshabaab ka dambeysay Qaraxyadii Hargeysa iyo Boosaaso Agaasimaha Hey'adda Sirdoonka Mareykanka ee CIA Michael Hayden ayaa hadal uu baahiyey wuxuu ku tilmaamay in qaraxyadii ka dhacay magaalooyinka Boosaaso iyo Hargeysa ee maamulada Somaliland iyo Puntland ay ahaayeen kuwa ay ka danbeeyey Ururka Al-Shabaab oo Mareykanku ku xiriiriyo shabakada Al-Qaacida ee uu hogaamiyo Osama Bin Ladin. Agaasimaha hay’ada CIA ayaa waxa ay sheegay in weeraradaasi ay ahaayeen kuwa kooxaha Shabaabku ku doonayeen inay kaga helaan Al-Qaacida wax uu ugu yeeray Qandaraasyo dhaqaale iyo taageero caalami. Michael Hayden ‘Weeradii dhawaan ka dhacay Soomaaliya waxay ahaayeen kuwa looga dan lahaa in lagu xoojiyo is tus tuska la isku xiriirinayo hogaamiyeyaasha Al-Qaacida, waxayan u egyihiin in kooxda Shabaab iyo Al-Qaacida ay ku siiyaan dhaqaale xagjiriinta Soomaaliya” sidaasi waxaa yiri Agaasimaha hay’ada CIA-da Mareykank. Ma jiro wax war ah oo ku aadan beenin ama rumeyn oo ka soo baxay xoogaga Al-Shabaab oo ku aadan warkan ka soo yeeray sarkaalkan Mareykanka ah ee ee xagooda ku riixay qaraxyadaasi. Michael Hayden mar uu ka hadlayey hogaamiyaha Shabada Al-Qaacida ayuu sheegay in uu yahay hada nin go’doon ka ah sida hadalka uu yiri ninkaasi hawlahii maskaxdiisa ka soo maaxay ee iminka ka soconaya meelo kala duwan oo caalamka, isla markaana aanu waxba kala socon hawlaha maalinlaha ee ay Al-Qaacida ka wado aduunka. Madaxa hay’ada sirdoonka Mareykanka ee CIA-da wuxuu xusey in ay si xoogan uga socdaan meelo kala duwan hawlgalada Al-Qaacida, isagoo soo qaatey dalalka Filipiin, Ciraaq, Indonesiya, iyo Sacuudi Carabiya, waxaana uu sheegay in hawlgaladaasi aanu waxba kala socon Osama Bin Ladin, wuxuuna farta ku fiiqay in dilka ama qabashada Bin Ladin ay wali u tahay yoolkooda ugu weyn. Hooyga wararka Somaliyed Jowhar.com & Jowharnews.com Jowharcom@hotmail.com

Maleeshiyo ka wada tirsan maxkamadaha Islaamiga ah oo isku laayey Sh. dhexe Wararka naga soo gaaraya magaalada Jowhar ee xarunta Gobolka Shabeelaha dhexe ayaa sheegaya in iska horimaad culus oo dhimasho iyo dhaawac dhaliyey uu dhexmarey maleeshiyaad ka wada tirsan maxkamadaha Islaamiga ee gacanta ku haya gobolka Shabeelaha dhexe. Iska horimaadkan oo geystey khasaare dhimasho ayaa waxaa dadka ku dhintey ka mid ahaa taliye kuxigeenkii ciidamada maxkamadaha Islaamiga ah ee gobolka Shabeelaha dhexe halka laba kale oo ka mid ahaa maleeshiyaadkaasi ay sidoo kale ku geeriyoodeen dagaalkaasi. Tafaasiisha ku saabsan iska horimaadkan ayaa waxaa ka soo baxaya warar kala duwan waxaa jira warar sheegaya in ciidamadaasi ay ku murmeen jidgooyo ay halkaasi dhigteen koox ka mid ah maleeshiyaadka Islaamiyiinta ee deegaankaasi ka taliya, waxaase jira warar kale oo sheegaya in iska horimaadku uu yimid ka dib markii ay isku dhaceen laba ciidan oo ka wada tirsan maxkamadaha oo isku khadmay. Sheekh Daahir Cadow Culusow oo ka mid ah masuuliyiinta maxkamadaha ayaa sheegay in dhacdadaasi oo ka dhacdey Kanaalka Shiinaha ay ahayd mid kama ah oo aanay jirin wax colaad ah, waxaana uu sheegay in ay isku dhaceen laba ciidan oo ka mid ah maxkamadaha oo iyagu si kala gooni ah ugu raad joogay kooxo isbaaro dhigtey wadada isku xirta Muqdisho iyo Jowhar. Gobolka Shabeelaha dhexe oo ay badi gacanta ku hayaan maxkamadaha Islaamiga ayaa waxaa laga soo sheegayaa falal amaan xumo oo geeray heer aad u sareeya, waxaana soo badanaya dilka dadka rayidka ah iyo waliba falalka kale ee burcadnimada hubaysan, iyadoo dadweynaha deegaankaasi ay amuurtan ku eedeynayaan maamulka deegaankaasi oo ay ku sheegeen in uu gacmaha ka laabtey waxka qabashada falalkan amaan xumo. Axmed Aar SBC International Muqdisho

Yuusuf Indha Cadde oo ka horyimid hub ka dhigis lagu sameeyo isaga iyo beeshiisa Yuusuf Maxamed Siyaad (Indha Cadde) oo lagu yaqaan xadgudubyadii uu ka geysan jiray gobolka Sh/Hoose ayaa lagu soo waramayaa in xiriir khadka isgaarsiinta uu kula soo sameeyay Afhayeenka Al-Shabaab Abuu Mansour Roobow. Yuusuf Indha Cadde oo ka horyimid hub ka dhigis lagu sameeyo isaga iyo beeshiisa Yuusuf Maxamed Siyaad (Indha Cadde) oo lagu yaqaan xadgudubyadii uu ka geysan jiray gobolka Sh/Hoose ayaa lagu soo waramayaa in xiriir khadka isgaarsiinta uu kula soo sameeyay Afhayeenka Al-Shabaab Abuu Mansour Roobow isla markaana uu ku amray Mr. Indha Cadde in hubkiisa uu ku soo wareejiyo Maliishiyada uu hoggaamiyo Abuu Mansour. Jaalle Indha Cadde ayaa arintaasi u cuntami weyday, wuxuuna sheegay in hubka uu haayo ay yihiin hub beeleed isla markaana hadii beeshiisa ay ku taliso in la wareejiyo uu diyaar u yahay inuu wareejiyo. "Hubka aan gacanta ku haayo waa mid beeleed, mana dhici doonto inaan si fudud ku wareejiyo, waayo hubkani waa mid aan wakiil ugu ahay beesha aan ka dhashay, hadii ay ku talisana inaan wareejiyo diyaar baan u ahay inaan ku dhaqaaqo" ayuu yiri Yuusuf Indha Cadde oo xiligan ku sugan magaalada. Muqdisho. Amar ka soo baxay ururka Al-Shabaab ayaa ka danbeeyay kadib markii dhawaan la dilay Nuuriye Cali Faarax oo la rumeysan yahay in gobalka uu Wakiil ugu ahaa Indha Cadde, isla markaana uu Yuusuf Indha Cadde oo meel fagaare ah ka hadlayey uu sheegay in maamul cusub oo badala kii horey ugu jiray magaaladaasi. Hadalka uu Yuusuf Indha Cadde uu jeediyay ayaa caro badan ku dhalisay xubnaha Al-Shabaab, taasoo keentay in ay si sahlan ula wareegaan magaalada Marka, waxaana xiligaasi magaalada ku sugnaa Indha Cadde iyo xoogag hubeysan ee la socda. Jaalle Indha Cadde ayaa xiligan diyaar u ah inuu isaga soo tago magaalada Muqdisho oo uu soo gaaray, waxaana uu ku soo fool leeyahay Gobolada Dhexe ee ay beeshiisu ka soo jeedo, iyadoo uu u muuqdo mid aan meelna ku xerneyn xiligan, iyadoo laga haayo afkiisa maah maahdii aheyd "Xidka Gef ee Xeebta ku ooy" oo ah maah maah Soomaalida soo qaadato marka ay meeshii ay ku tiirsanaayeen ka tagaan meeshii ay doonayaana ay kala kulmaan soo dhoweyn la'aan.

Jowhar: Taliye ku xigenkii ciidamada Maxkamadaha ee saldhiga Jowhar oo ku dhintay iska horimaad 14. November 2008 Jowhar(AllPuntland)-Isku dhac kedis ah ayaa ciidamo ka wada tirsan Maxkamaddaha Islaamiga ku dhex maray Keliga Shiinaha oo ka tirsan gobolka Sh/Dhexe halkaasi waxaana ku geeriyooday sarkaalka la yiraahdo Sheekh C/salaan, waxaana ku dhaawacmay hal ruux. Isku dhacan ayaa yimid kadib markii ciidamo kale oo Maxkamadaha ka tirsan ay gaareen halkaasi, waxayna baadi goob ugu jireen kooxo burcad ah oo dad rayid ah ku dilay inta u dhaxeysa Jowhar iyo Mahadaay, waxaana si kedis ah dagaal gaaban u dhex maray ciidamadaasi, iyadoo uu ku geeryooday Sarkaalkaasi oo la sheegay in uu ahaa Taliye ku xigeenka ciidamada ee xabsiga magaalada Jowhar. Sarkaalkan geeriyooday ayaa la sheegay in maalmahan uu ku sugnaa Keliga Shiinaha isaga iyo ciidamo uu watay, waxayna ku maqnaayeen Gadood ahaan, balse isku dhacan ayaan aheyn mid gadoodka ka dhashay. Khilaafka Saraakiisha Maxkamaddaha ee Gobolka Sh/Dhexe ayaa mudooyinkan soo badanayey iyadoo Guddoomiyaha Isbaheysiga Asmara garabka Jabuuti Sheekh Shariif Sh. Axmed oo soo gaaray Jowhar uu xaliyay khilaafaadka jira, balse imaanshahiisa ay sii dhalisay khilaaf kale, waxaana jira warar sheegaya in maamul cusub loo sameynayo Gobolka Sh/Dhexe, kaasoo ay u badnaan doonaan xubnaha saraakiisha ah ee taabacsan Shekh Shariif. AllPuntland, Jowhar

Maxkamada oo ku dagaalmey degmada Jowhar 14 Nov 14, 2008 - 12:30:43 AM Ugu yaraan laba qof oo uu ku jiro sarkaal sare ayaa ku dhintay dagaal duleedka Jowhar ku dhexmaray laba maleeshiyo oo ka wada tirsan Maxkamadaha Islaamka. Dagaalkan ayaa la sheegay inuu yahay mid salka ku haya maamulka Gobolkaas; balse madaxda gacanta ku haya gobolka ayaa dagaalka ku tilmaamay mid ku dhacay si lama filaan ah. Macalin Daahir Cadow Calasow oo warbaahinta la hadlay ayaa sheegay in labada kooxood ee dagaalamay ay ka wada tirsanaayeen Maxkamadaha, dagaalkooduna uu ahaa mid ku dhacay aqoonisdaro. "Taliye ku xigeenkii saldhiga Jowhar ayaa ka mid ah labada qof ee dhintay, waxaana kooxda weerarka soo qaaday ay ku raad-joogeen burcad dhibaatooyin ka wada wadada isku xigta Hiiraan iyo Sh/dhexe" ayuu yiri Macalin Daahir. Warar kale oo madax banaan ayaa waxay sheegayaan in dagaalkan ay soo qaadeen kooxo taageersan Sheekh Yuusuf Tuurxume oo sheeganaya inuu yahay gudoomiyaha Gobolka Sh/dhexe. Mas'uul u hadlay Sheekh Yuusuf Tuurxume ayaa sheegay in Maleeshiyada taabacsan Macalin Daahir ay xoog ku haystaan gobolka, ayna diideen inay maamulka wareejiyaan, sidaa daraadeedna ay goosteen inay xoog adeegsadaan. Keliga Shiinaha oo ay howlo dayactir ah ka wadeen Maleeshiyo taabacsan Macalin Daahir ayaa la sheegay in laga eryay oo ay haatan ku sugan yihiin Maleeshiyo taageersan Sheekh Yuusuf Tuurxume. Dhaqdhaqaaqyo xoogan ayaa ka taagan degmada Jowhar ee xarunta Gobolka Sh/dhexe, kuwaasoo ka dhashay weerarkii ka dhacay duleedka Jowhar, iyadoo dadka gobolkaas ay cabsi weyn ka qabaan in korkooda lagu dagaalamo. Garowe Online, Jowhar

MMA I apologies for any inconvenience caused. I will stick to the topic and aside from ironic remarks will tend to stay clear of attacks. Thanks

Lool the old horse with no rider, no direction and argument or axis to base his argument,if you are still itching to reveal something or have information leading to the abducted youths then by all means we can have a full discussion and of course in private to protect you from your handlers. If the aim of your vomit is to get the attention of the few gullible fellows to enlist in your agencies next travel plans then I can not help nor do I want to besmirch my name and good standing. I press on you to think of the suffering of the parents, the family and the community and the youth as you would your own. Its easy for us to hold artificial boundaries and make statements, but the political climate is always beyond our individual control, we can predict and make forecasts but we can not lead or have a direct inflaunce on the variables that make the events on the ground take their shape. This time old mare we find ourselves in a different situation; we can have an impact in helping, in stopping and educating this community to focus on this and other dangers, because this is our home now we have a duty not to just talk but to take action. Thus the choices you make with this issue will have a lasting significance the information you may hold can mean a great deal, and valuable in alleviating the suffering of a fellow human being or even uniting a family. Jokes aside your stance is perplexing and quite dangerous, you are directing people to keep silent and boasting about. The silence helps who, the innocent or the criminal? Also when can someone come forward and give information that can help solve a crime, when can we turn to the authorities?, the spike in the inter Somali killings through gang violence of late could be prevented or at least reduced if more people had the courage to tell who was behind it and testified. Thus while you tried to be amusing and a hero, you came through as ill-informed, irresponsible and out of touch reactionary. You are not defending a Mosque or a group of righteous people, no you are encouraging criminal behavior and institutionalizing ignorance. That’s why sir you are not on my level and need to go back eating hay.

^^^Hunguri, stop it ina adeer, Xiin will get upset he has no one to commend him and say anything posative.. Emperor, old man things are crazy here ladies are on Somali TV looking for their kids.

there needs to be a community wide investigation

To the agents of ignorance and intolerence. These remarks would have been posted on the closed topic. Thus enjoy. Reviewing the long drivel, response from the old horse and shaking ones head I have decided to go easy on the horse and gave him,, a [ HF] grade, a horrible F for both content and effort. Like the puppet master you have been stringed along and played with. Rearranging your weak arguments got you no reprieve. You thought you had a winning formula with using the word “snitch” ignorant as a Hip Hop artist telling the youth don’t speak to the police, don’t give evidence even if you witness mass murder this is the logic of the ill-bred straight from the ghetto and it is one we should not be preaching in our community and to our people. I cringed witnessing an old horse trying to be hip and with the times, “yo snitch” amusing as it was the sheer failure at the endeavor made me contemplate stopping the discourse just to stop the humiliation you was inflecting on your person, the fact that you thought a single word would silence an old soldier highlighted another all too clear deficit. Then you went for the laypersons touch and tried to engender the support of the usual mob the desperate groups who oppose the expectant ones, those who use logic above emotion and do not pretend to be Muslim martyrs while happily shopping at Best Buy or Target and voting for the Democratic party in Kuffar land . We those with human feelings and compassion are disgusted by the horrific brainwashing and subsequent snatching of our youths and pained by the suffering of our parents we can not accept the burden and the deep hurt that we collectively feel because of the actions of a few vagabonds the networks Xiin, the horse and his cohorts in the agency of ignorance and intolerance support and defending . I tell you that truth is truth and falsehood is as dark as the night. Your pretences are weak and your denial and lack of condemnation and even excuse making for the atrocities committed by this Al Shabaab outfit and its agents in this instance is frighteningly clear. You seem to be in cahoots with or least an apologist an appeaser no doubt, at worst and enabler, may you find your sense of decency and open your eyes, the grass you have been chewing has been full of the bad stuff no nutrients to help the aged, you need greener pastures old mare. My observations with regards to your person over the past two days have been mixed, your tenacity and argumentative persona was quite amusing it reminded me of all the hot headed Somali’s one has met through life, specially the over zealous type who think they have the panacea to all our problems. Your attempts at changing the subject were mixed, aside from trying to turn the issue personal you missed on the opportunity of giving your side of the story explaining, why these agents should be spared and in your words not “snitched” on, why they are so important that they deserve the lives of the youth the mourning of the parents the suffering of their extended family and the deaths of civilians at their hands back home. Sir you have not given us any reason why these criminals should be treated otherwise. Not even a twisted religious argument that we have come to expect from such groups and their modern day arm char warriors. Also note that, one must be able to take it as one gives, its ammsuing you have tried to spin the riding the horse considering your name was ridden by none other than a General of a past age, again a man who wants to call himself a horse a famous one and has the argumentative style of an untrained horse should not protest so. To the comrades who came to your rescue I applaud their sense of duty but again they attacked the Duke and landed no punches, considering one is now reporting on Makhir and the other is looking for his lost ball. Now lets continue …

Labo X: Now this no time for the kids to be speaking the old horse has been battered and bruised and is throwing the towel, you are twice as incompetent thus what can you hope to accomplish?

Xiin, Maskin, adeer did anyone commend you for your skills yet? “Somaliland, Al Shabaab Islamic Courts supporters “ I urge you, speak well of the old horse” for he is need some soothing words form someone anyone, and quick nominate him for something. He is again suffering from bouts of doubts and inferiority complex...

^^^Emperor, funny how all these folks used to be so big. The last JVA has fled, Nuriye was blown up. Justice is amazing. Lets hope these confused clowns also depart as fast and let locals run every village in Somalia. Hornafrik, Shabbele Radio and Co will not report this, will they today.

My man Emperor, don’t worry I am just putting a few knuckle heads in their places. And the chit chat while harmless, it also helps the topic stay at the top. Now I know you do not live here, but crazy stuff has been happening and community is shocked the facts are that some young men, up to seven maybe more, some teenagers others in their early 20s have been brainwashed and taken to Somalia for martyrdom operation or kill yourself vacations. The families of these kids have not been told, and some got phone calls to “congratulate them", Hamas and Fatah style There is uproar going on and Mr Xiin seems to be full of guilt and since yesterday he has been trying to get the strength to confess something and has been calling the Duke and others “snitches” and going rabid with rage. now what has he done that merits us snitching on him?

^^^That was funny. They need a warlords reunion.

LbaX: The youngest ***** comes in taking the **** lead, and thinks he has said something important. How do you know about such things did you come out of a closet? Even the silly boasts of yesterday has been toned down. [ November 13, 2008, 05:10 PM: Message edited by: Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar ]

^^^One has to have a thing to snitch about, defending our kids, and debunking the confused network is a noble task, the confused agents of intolerence & ignorance led by the horses keepers will not have their way. Not under my watch

[/b]The old ***** is deperate[/b], Those who have doubt their leanings tend to mention such things. Also calling the troops did not work now you want to use your leanings, god forbid ya shiekh I dont think its natural at all. Anyhow horse you need more *****. Now interpret that. [ November 13, 2008, 05:07 PM: Message edited by: Miskiin-Macruuf-Aqiyaar ]