Old_Observer

History seems to repeat - Ottomans

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History is repeating, of course with different appearances and methods, but the players are all projeny of the ancestors.

 

The Chinese were great power 3 times before in recorded history and now are coming back. The Persians were great power twice in recorded history and they are coming back with changed name Iran. The Roman Empire of Rome is in Washington DC. The Byzantine empire, Roman Empire east is in Russia and they are coming back (with some moral support of Greece, Bulgaria, Serbia etc). Even the Ottomans are coming back as Turkey.

 

Turkey is not hiding its intension of supporting peoples that the Ottomans ruled, to be strong each in their locality. I read a piece of news today that the Sudan handed over to Turkey the old Port and Island of Suakin, about 60km south of Port Sudan for Turkey to rebuild it and use it as a base. It will put Turkey close to Israeli base, Egyptians, Saudis (this place was port of departure and return to Mecca Medina in old times, before modern ships, aeroplane etc. If Turkey establishes bases in Somalia (including Puntland and Somaliland) and in Sudan, there will be hope for the people of Yemen. They are next and most important.

 

What do you think?

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Holac   
Quote

If Turkey establishes bases in Somalia (including Puntland and Somaliland) and in Sudan, there will be hope for the people of Yemen. They are next and most important.

 

 

The Turks are very interested in Yemen because of historic ties. Many Yemenis trace their roots to Turkey including Tawakal Karman, the Yemeni Nobel laureate whose family comes from the Karaman Province of Turkey. But Turkey doesn't want to see the Shiite domination of the region and for that, the Houthis are not their choice to lead Yemen. Complicating the Yemen situation, however, is Turkey's deteriorating relations with the Gulf countries after Qatar was isolated. Publicly, Turkey supports the Saudi-led coalition to oust the Houthis. 

 

Image result for Tawakkol Karman Turkish Erdogan

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40 minutes ago, Holac said:

 

The Turks are very interested in Yemen because of historic ties. Many Yemenis trace their roots to Turkey including Tawakal Karman, the Yemeni Nobel laureate whose family comes from the Karaman Province of Turkey. But Turkey doesn't want to see the Shiite domination of the region and for that, the Houthis are not their choice to lead Yemen. Complicating the Yemen situation, however, is Turkey's deteriorating relations with the Gulf countries after Qatar was isolated. Publicly, Turkey supports the Saudi-led coalition to oust the Houthis. 

 

 

 

 

Holac,

You are right. The only 3 countries that ever stayed long in Yemen are the Habeshi, the Persians and Ottomans. Every body else even the British was dispatched in short order. The egyptians still remember and even recent I saw an article on Al-Ahram of how they were humiliatingly defeated in Yemen (under Jamal Abdelnasser no less).

The Houthi are not problem for Turkey. Just consider the warming and even heating relation of Turkey-Serbia, since the Albanians tried to deal with Europe and America bypassing Turkey.  The problem is Saudi Arabia. If by some incident the Saudi stumbles, you will see very fast Turkey getting in with Qatar money. The Iranians and Russians and also the Chinese will also back Turkey. It would be so good to see Turkey both sides of the sea and all other empires reduced status. If we are no where to do ourselves then the next best thing is good enough. The biggest loser will be Pakistan which is so deeply vested with the Saudis.

 

What do you think the possibility of Yemen continuing as one country. The Southerners do not seem committed to a united Yemen. Every now and then they change direction.

 

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galbeedi   

It is a good discussion.

 

Great nations and people will always trace their ancestors history and achievements to reach higher goals. That is why those of us who trace their history through the modern icon of Somali nationalism , the great Darwiish, and historical figures like Ahmed Gurey , would never accept a weak and divided Somalia. Despite  it's dysfunction and  autocracy, many of us are even nostalgic of the Somalia we lost thirty yeargo.

 

I agree. The biggest obstacle to peaceful and harmony in the middle east is the Saudis. I read that Turkey and Iran had agreed to discourage and eliminate the useless sectarian  conflict fueled by the gulf. Today, the biggest threat to the Muslim world is the sectarian conflict between the Sunnis and the Shias, and if these nations find solution to this  menace , expect good things to happen.

 

I hope the Houthis will accept a cease fire and form a government with the Mansour Haddi group. The problem is the Saudis will not allow him to enter any negotiations.The Yemenis are tough and resilient people who unlike the artificial countries of the gulf had a couple  thousand years old history. The Southern Yemenis could be defeated easily if Sana becomes stable. If Aden, one of the oldest ports in the world, port Sudan, port SAid in Egypt, Berbera, Mogadishu, and Bosaso become commercial hubs for trade around the region with over two hundred million people trading in goods, energy, livestock and agricultural products,  there will be a boom in this region.  the gulf nations like UAE will eat their sand. They could be reduced just  like another  nightclub or Las Vegas style casino country where the rich Arabs go for party. I do believe that their efforts to destabilize the region is partly  for business interest..

 

Turkey is entering to these huge nations  like Sudan with untapped  resources that needs to be developed. Sudan was decimated by sanctions and other issues like the South Sudan issue for twenty years. They have a huge land that can be farmed and other mineral resources. With strategic alliances with Turkey, they might eve check the Egyptian dictator SISi and slow down the NIle water.

 

Turkey is also building connections with Serbia as you mentioned because of Albania and even Bosnia -Herzegovina,  who despite the cultural connections , decided to vote against Turkey. In the third quarter of 2017,  the Turkish economy grew 11%, an unprecedented growth in any economy.  Last year after the failed coup of 2016,  I said ,  if Turkey survives 2017 without major tremors from Syria, they will be a power that can not be stopped  anymore like India, China or Russia.  

 

Thanks to Trump there will a great realignment of the international order that ruled the world since the second world war.

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@galbeedi

 

Thank you. That was very informative and analytic post.

 

To add to the greatness of the Turks, they are renovating and preparing for visitors and researchers the whole place around Negash in Ethiopia (Tigray). The mosque there is I think one of the less than 10 oldest and original ones in the world. The Turks are spending money and expertise in renovating the place. It is mosque and burial grounds of the first companions.

 

I would also like to add for the Sudanese. Most generous people. The Egyptians never defeated the Sudanese in all their conflicts. The Egyptians always have to come with Ottomans, French, British.. even to attempt. The Sudanese are also most unique in Africa in the fact that every single one of their leaders deposed by coup or not lived, died and burried in his own country. No other African country can say that. Maybe Zimbabwe is now going to prove me wrong.

Sudan signed and supported Ethiopia against Egypt in the Nile contraversy, would not allow Egypt to do anything against Ethiopia from Sudan. When Al-Bashir did his press conference after lifting of sanctions by US, the first country he thanked was Ethiopia. Of corse the Ethiopians have paid some price for their stance. They refused to join ICC for the sake of Sudan, helped him get out of South Africa who would have arrested him..etc. That is character on his part and Ethiopians as well.

 

The Somali also showed Character all of them, in refusing to allow Egypt to set up any operations against Ethiopia. The first TFG set at Arta Dgibouti fell apart for agreeing to allow Egypt not only to set bases, but resettle people and farms for its food in Somalia.

 

People with character suffer from material loss and life and limb as well, but are also survivors. From Afghanistan to Yemen t Somali to Sudan and Syria..etc that is what you see. BTW Egyptians never completely ruled themselves, always under protectorate, direct colony of any powerful country/empire.

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galbeedi   

Waar ninkaygani mararka qaarkood , far waaweyn in wax la iigu qoro ayaan u baahanahay.

 

Wiigan bilowgiisi ayya ninka la yidhaahdo "Tilamook" uu tilmaamay ninkan OldO in uusan Soomaali ahayn oo uusan fahmayn maroodiga la isku jabinayo. I guess , I am an  old timer. You guys are quick, smart and sophisticated, and I admire the way you detect the foreigners.

 

Bal miyaan hadalka Tilamook ku baraarugo oo ninkan reer Abysiinia ee propogaandhada noola yinid aan is ka garto. Waxaan mooday nin reer Jijiga ah oo Danaha Soomalida wada. Markaan arkay sida uu Masar ugu kulul yahay ayaan ku gartay. Dictatorka Masar ma jecli , laakiin dadka reer Masar in dhib gaadho ma ogolin

 

. We might not like the Egyptian dictator, but we love our " Masaari" brothers. Mr. OLd O, I detect from your post that for you everything revolves about " Egypt hate"  like most Tigray guys. You Talk about a not existent war between Egypt and Yemen and old sort of things. We Somalis know our adversaries and our enemies. 

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Holac   

Galbeedi, I never thought Old_Observer was Somali. He could also be Somali with strong ties to TPLF (remember Illey was crying helpless when Meles died).  Does it matter though? He is informative and plays by the rules. Isn't it our job to counter views we don't agree with?

 

17 hours ago, Old_Observer said:

Sudan signed and supported Ethiopia against Egypt in the Nile contraversy, would not allow Egypt to do anything against Ethiopia from Sudan. When Al-Bashir did his press conference after lifting of sanctions by US, the first country he thanked was Ethiopia. Of corse the Ethiopians have paid some price for their stance. They refused to join ICC for the sake of Sudan, helped him get out of South Africa who would have arrested him..etc. That is character on his part and Ethiopians as well.

 

OO, I didn't know Ethiopia was instrumental in getting ICC off Al-Bashir's back.  Al-Sisi is a merciless dictator who is murdering his own people. I have not come across any Somali who likes that man. Don't be surprised if you hear Egypt and Saudi Arabia are planning to counter Erdogan's move on Sudan. 

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I too never consider him to be SOMALI, and I don't believe he is SOMALI. Must be Tigray Intelligent officer,wonder how many other alias he is using here.

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Why daught yourselves instead doing just a simple search for truth.

 

Yemen was Egypt's Vietnam

Washington Post

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2015/03/28/how-yemen-was-once-egypts-vietnam/

 

"In this terrain," the New Republic explained with Orientalist relish in 1963, "the slow-moving Nile Valley peasant has proved a poor match for the barefoot, elusive tribesmen armed only with rifle and jambiya -- the vast, curved, razor-sharp dagger which every male Yemeni wears in his belt."

At the peak of deployments, Nasser committed as many as 70,000 Egyptian soldiers to Yemen. After the war's end in 1970, Yemen remained a republic, but Egypt had paid a terrible price: More than 10,000 Egyptian soldiers died and the country ran up massive war debts. The conflict has been dubbed "Egypt's Vietnam," and is cited as one of the reasons why the Egyptian military suffered such a withering defeat in the Six-Day War with Israel in 1967.

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Those of you that think I am Tigray and should not be read:

I would consider lucky if I were Tigray for the simple reason, its the place and people who have one of the oldest and contneously used Synagoge, the first church since they are first kingdom to declare christianity and to cup it all one of the first mosques at Negash. For a bonus monastery in Jerusalem "Dier Sultan". Can you name any other territory or people with so much gifted.

 

For those of you who think a Tigray inside your computer, under every tree shed in the desert, under every bed (western saying):

In 2007 there was a cartoon from Amin Amir (I do not have a link for it now, but the message was as follows:

 

Shiek Ahmed and Shiek Aweys were cursing and cussing at Tigray, during their conference in Eritrea until young Aideed came and told them "There is more Tigray control here in Eritrea than that in Ethiopia, don't get us thrown out of here"

 

That should explain.

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18 minutes ago, Holac said:

OO,  I heard that 30% - 40% of Tigray people is Muslim, especially in Eritrea.  Is that number accurate?

 

From some reading In Eritrea its 50-50, but in Ethiopia Tigray Orthodox are almost 90%. There are more than 9 nationalities in Eritrea and 4 nationalities in Tigray Ethiopia. 5 of the nationalities in Eritrea and all 4 of nationalities in Ethiopia Tigray are shared common with Eritrea-Ethiopia.

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Old Observer admires the Somali people. We should welcome him with open arms. We don't care if he is a Yahuud or Siberian. His ethnicity is irrelevant.  

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Barwaaqo   

Oo

Oo annigu Ingiriisiba ma qoree sidee qoraalkayga ku fahamtay , Waxaan arkayey adigoo soo xiganaya hadal aan qoray. Waliba Waxaan isku dayaa Inaan qoro farsomali aan la google-turjimi karin xiligan. AFkayaga miyaad baratay?

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