The government gets its way- Gains more than the 139 majority:

[Xoogsade]

Wind.Talker, Dambi miyaa haddaan dhahay waa lagu dulmiyey and as such, your/his rage IS JUSTIFIED and for that you/he are/is forgiven for whatever silly comments you/he make/s? Cuqdada iska saar. Perhaps once you do that you won't see what you like in what people write. There has to be a reason why some people in this forum act the way they do. Some are driven by tribal reasons while others may be sincere and hope better future for all somalis. Besides, Dadka kuma digto aniga, gaar ahaan qof in la dulmiyey sheeganaaya. Teeda kale, run ma aha miyaa in dadka qaarkii iyagoon xamar weligood arag iska sheegtaan iney kasoo carareen? Actually majority have never seen xamar. Xiinfaniin might be one of them. His tribe(if his GALTI accent is of any indication) now lives whole areas in madino and have their own share of the market in Bakaraha, they find a welcome home in town and are equal bretheren, yet, his antagonism towards the town is strange. Waa dadka waxaan dan ugu jirin luqunta la galo oo sidaas dantooda ku seego. My advise to him waxaa waaye inuu dadkiisa dhinac ka raaco.

[xiinfaniin]

loooool@His tribe(if his GALTI accent is of any indication) now lives whole areas in madino and have their own share of the market in Bakaraha, they find a welcome home in town and are equal bretheren, yet, his antagonism towards the town is strange.

 

That's just hilarious story . cajaa'ibtaadey ka mid tahay

 

But Xoogsadow, Ninka xaaraanta uu dhacay weli xoolihiisa u qaba, Ilaah warkiisa ma maqlo ilaa u garawsado xumihiisa, celiyana xaqqa uu dhacay! Warninyahow show diinta wax badan baan kasoo gaarin? Maxay tahay Ilaah baa leyskaa xigadaad sheegeysid? Sxb, you're in dire need for some basic Islamic schooling! Sideed u garanweydey inaan tawbadda tuugga la aqbalin hadduu weli xoolihii heysto. If you beleive that, not only do you sound like a lost sheep but you're also making a mockery on the essence of Islamic justice.

 

saaxiib, cuqdaddi waa cudurka ku hayya.Waa waxa dawladnimada kaa hortaagan.Waxaase adiga kuu wehliya jahli diineed. Inaad jihaadaad rabtaa xoolo islaameedna waa kuu sahay waa caqliyadda aad lasoo shirtagtey. Waxbadan baa runtii kaa qaldan. As for who's from Xamar and who's not, it doesn't really matter now, or does it? When hundreds of thousands of people from the heart of miyi are calling it home. Xaaraanta uun ha la is ka daaayo magaaladu dadkoo dhan waa deeqdaaye.

 

P.S: So you detect my lahjad to be non-Xamar! But don't you realize that it doesn't sound much different than that of Caato or Cabdul-Qaasim (the leaders of the city)?

[Xoogsade]

Xiinfaniin , I know the prayer of the thief(as you put it) or the prayer of the one whose income comes from a forbidden source won't be accepted. However, as you daringly accuse everyone out there in Xamar and even not the ones over there like me to have stolen something from you, WHY SHOULD I BOTHER DIGNIFYING SUCH TALK with credence? According to your posts, you already decided everyone from these tribes are thieves who have stolen something and live in people's homes and their prayers aren't accepted. Because of that, why should I reason with someone with such mentality? War waxaad doonto aaminsanoow anigana horaan kuu sii turaantureynaa noh Waxaan iskala weynahay inaan ku saxo adigana sheeko kalaaba ii gashey. But you are right, I always needed islamic knowledge and will need one as even scholars of islam never claimed to have accomplished the sea that is islamic knowledge. Qof walba waa ardey deep down including the islamic teachers or so I think. And I am not a student let alone anything else in the knowledge chart. So yes, I need islamic knowledge for certain.

 

As for GALTI, Yea, you sound one. I think reer waamo version of you are much easier to get along with lol. Just like reer mudugs are quite different from anyone who was born and raised in banadir and jubbooyinka, you guys are a little more hotheaded and different. Anyhow, DAMBIGA GURO SAAXIB.

 

 

PS: Xamar soo galeeti ayaa la wareegey runtii. It completely changed population-wise or ALMOST. But that wasn't the issue we were talking about in here. And yes, you sound more like Atto/mudug accentwise although I am sure you are Qolada Sayidka(shiilaabo version). That is why I called you GALTI. And yes, Xamarna waa joogtaan, your home as everyone else. I think you were confused when I said "dadkaada dhinac ka raac, equal brethren, the market share". Muqdisho Hal qabiil oo kaliya kuma noolo. Communities kala duwanaa ku nool hadda haba yaraadeen aad tiro ahaan. We want that to continue as that is the future.

[xiinfaniin]

To conclude what has been informative, but at times ranting, discussion:

 

Xoogsade’s argument:

 

1- The people of Xamar will undertake a Jihaad against this government if it comes to Xamar to defend what’s dearly theirs and will eventually prevail.

2-There is no such thing as occupied towns or cities and the occupied properties are in insignificant and unworthy of discussion (only the ill-intenders would scream about it to vilify the people of Xamar.)

 

My Argument:

 

1- war initiated by known thugs (Caato, Qanyare, Yalaxow, and Indhacadde) will be any thing but a Jihaad. The reason is because what that ilk is fighting for is to preserve the ill-gotten gains of the civil war and to prevent any kind of government (regardless of its leaders) that could restore normalcy.

2- Xamar is full of people who are occupying properties that are not theirs and as such it is an occupied city. So as Kismayo, Marka, and Bravo. To deny this political reality or minimize its religious, social, and political ramifications is a pure ignorant. To wrap the cause of those scofflaws with Islamic flag is scornfully contemptuous thinking of the basic Islamic teachings. A mockery to the Islamic concepts that we hold dear.

 

 

 

P.S: for your own information, I am not even remotely related to that clan you mentioned. A challenge to your hasty conclusion, one may say.

[Rahima]

^ Brother, you state:

 

Xamar is full of people who are occupying properties that are not theirs and as such it is an occupied city.

So i ask, how is that you have come to know that xamar is "full" (the point which i am contesting here, you are stating that it is extremely widespread and is the majority case) of people who are occupying property which is not theirs?

 

I mean have their been studies done?, statistics concluded? By what measurements (aside from the somali grapevine and the ever so wonderful media of ours ) have you come to conclude this?

 

The other issue is, do you acknowledge or even accept that perhaps the opposite is the case? That this issue of occupying is over-exaggerated, that the city is full of people who are rightfully there and have worked hard for their property and businesses? Is this is a possiblity, or are you adamant that this issue of occupation (particularly in xamar which is what i know of) is as certain folks claim it to be?

 

Be mindful when replying that I am not denying that it exists, but it is to the degree (which you have elevated to "full") which i contest.

[xiinfaniin]

Rahima,

 

Xamar, is the only city I know in all what’s Somali cities. Besides two months stop at Kismayo and not more than few weeks in agricultural farm in Qoryooley, I have known no any other city than Xamar (believe me, sister). Now, you ask me how I’ve come to know that a lot of properties are occupied? Oh well, to paraphrase an Arab poem, it’s a sheer intellectual emptiness to debate about the existence of the sun. where have you been, sister, to ask such an abvious question?

 

Begun with all my family and my relatives (and they’re not GALTI as Xoogsade would like us believe). I know generations who’ve been uprooted by the invading ilk. Sister, lest you’re attracted by Xoogsade’s depiction of my stance or you’re emotionally biased by what you’ve seen in you recent trip, it’s apparrent that Xamar is an occupied city. Close to million people fled with their lives and their properties taken. Entire clans come from the Miyiand competed for the share of the big prize. In my opinion the matter of properties and land is the heart of Somalia’s southern conflict.

 

Yes I acknowledge and appreciate the hard-earned assets of the good people of the city. I am not under illusion neither am I consumed by the false impression that Xamar is an evil city or anything that’s Xamar is bad. I consider it truly my city. But I see it as the reason of Somalia’s political stalemate.

 

Anyone who knows any thing about Xalaal and Xaraam would just understand these facts.

[wind.talker]

Mohamed Dheere - a Benaadir native - said that South Muqdisho is occupied. XOOGSADE, will you accuse him of also being a tribalist (meaning he's hating on USC folks - while he himself is a USC leader)? I guess everyone that says Marka-Kismaayo corridor is occupied is wrong - and everyone who supports the occupation is doing the right thing! Wonderful thinking. Keep justifying your cousins' subjugation of poor Banadiris sxb. I'm done!

[Xoogsade]

Xiinfaniin, People will do what is best for them in case a war breaks out headed by A/Y. You are better off I think joining his ranks and become a footsoldier for him to die what you believe is a religious cause and getting back your lost home(you are getting your property back and might earn shahiid status in the process).

 

There is nothing sacred about this government, it is neither religious nor based on anything other than what destroyed the country to begin with. In that case, once A/Y and his ilk forget the reasons behind people's acceptance of this government and what made the government legitimate, which was to make peace, compromise and obsolutely no wars, PEOPLE HAVE THE RIGHT TO DEFEND THEMSELVES FROM ANOTHER WARLORD. Atto and Yalaxoow to US are the same as A/Y while you differentiate between them because he is remotely or closely related to you. We don't separate one bigot from the other and we will have an issue with A/Y as much as we do have with ATTO and YALAXOOW today. Men cut from the same cloth of bigotry, tribalism, killing to be the top dog in their communities(tell me A/Y didn't do that), they are nothing but the vile of our society A/Y included. Adiga iyo kuwa kula midka ah yuu A/Y saviour u yahay, for us, he is nothing but someone we will tolerate for the common good if he doesn't warmonger. He has no mandate to fire a bullet in Xamar, devide brethren, and cause more mayhem than people have already experienced. He has to find a way to work with others, WAA TUUGADISEE HALA HESHIIYO, it is non of our business. But it will be our business once he decides to devide communities and brings Amxaaro along with him(if they dare come to begin with).

 

PS: Don't waste your time if you consider my talk ranting. Do something else with your time. Be smart.

 

Also, NO ONE in xamar needs your acknowledgement that they earn their money and abode through their workmanship. Don't go through pains saying that. They are all thieves and murderers.

 

Wind.talker

 

 

Bro, Men who belong to the same tribe Mohamed dheere belongs to have a different opinion and consider others from Mudug as legitimate residents in the town who can reside there as they please. They have contributed much to the town and are the backbone of the city in many aspects. In any case, It all depends on who is talking and according to their political alignment/affliation(Mohamed dheere speaks for A/Y), or in some case like you, the tribal feelings determine how events are seen You don't like them FOLKS from Hobyo I saw.

[xiinfaniin]

Though that noble goal (getting back what is lawfully yours) is worth fighting, it would apparently involve some filthy business in the way, which I wouldn’t desire (mind you) to soul my hands with. It was a mere Conscious satisfaction (the discussion was), sxb. Not that I want to join the fighting force of the old man. Let the suddenness and Ugandans do the liberation! And take it easy, it may just be the case that when the day comes, the thugs surrender in masses and the innocent come out savely unharmed.

[Xoogsade]

Xiinfaniin, Instead of these troops going there "LIBERATING" anything for you, let us hope they don't become themselves victims of a violence they haven't anticipated before coming. That is what I am worried about. The locals are the ones who will actually give safety and will aid these troops to facilitate the disarmament or whatever they come for doing. So without the help of the locals and their guide, these troops are sitting ducks let alone liberators of anything.

 

There is a lot to worry about the future than to entertain false hopes and fleeting happiness that things will work certain favourable way of yours and the good omens for a victory are there, the enemies will be defeated and etc. I don't understand where you guys are getting from these hopes of winning against the odds that are in your way. To me, these problems are insurmountable and the only way is to forget about trying any war. Like I said, it will be tribal. The mentality of tribalism is still alive and the government was based on tribalism, the men appointed were appointed to please certain tribes, Do you see how the beginning of this so called government was a set-up for the ultimate failure? It is easy for many people to justify a war in support of their local warlord. A/Y will fail if he chooses to fight.

[xiinfaniin]

Don't you wory, good Xoogsade, about the safety of these Fts as they're mere means to accomplish desirable and noble goals: to help this government settle. Sacrificial lambs, if you will, for the greater cause!

Somalis seem to have failed to see beyond clanish politics and thier differences are unbridgeable (eg. you and me: dadkaaga dhinac ka raac .vs. inyow, I want my property back). So lets wait and see if one side delivers (as it seems now) the decisive beat to the punch.

 

It may be true that legitimacy, in the primitive thinking of Somalis, could only be achieved by the utter dominance of one side of the conflict. It may also be true (sounds very primitive, I admit) might reigns supreme and our conscious respects its (the might that is) savage power. We're indeed resorting to trickery to gain our worldly-ends. Reasoning has met its demise, sxb. And so I say, let the guns start blazing and (as I started my 1st post in this thread) lets pray only the wicked souls perish in its shooting hell!

 

You see, gardarraddii oo tookheysaa soo shirtagtey. Waxaan is-lahaa atleast 15 years waa ku filantahay dadka. Waase male hungoobey: la mood noqonse weydey.

 

You see, I am ready to tolerate dictatorship (Mr. Yusuf) if we can atleast regain our lost nationhood. I can even entartain secessionist politics if it provides governance (Somaliland). What I can't put up with is the politics of sheer thuggery and the hoodlum gangs in Xamar, sxb. The endless looping and the deceptive manuevering of that ilk (Xamar walords) that only prolongs the suffering of the residents of that besieged city. I think, I've said enough, I should stop now.

[Rahima]

Brother in all honesty I have not followed the exchange between you and Xoogsade (so attraction would not be possible ), I just chose to question that last post of yours.

 

Oh well, to paraphrase an Arab poem, it’s a sheer intellectual emptiness to debate about the existence of the sun. where have you been, sister, to ask such an abvious question?

Look brother you still have not answered my question, how is that you come to know that this is extremely widespread and in essence the city is occupied? Like I said what piece of credible information do you have for us (words on the Somali grapevine do not count)? I mean sure, it has become the popular thing these days for folks to cry day in and day out that Mogadishu is occupied and when you ask them how they come to know that this is the majority case, they often give responses similar to yours, where have you been? Oh my god everyone knows. But this is not what I asked; I asked HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT IT IS TO THE DEGREE WHICH YOU CLAIM? Please share it with us.

 

Brother I am not denying the existence of the matter, like I said it is the degree which I question. I’ve often wondered, has anyone tried to retrieve their land (because I know for a fact that he who can legally prove that land belongs to them will have it returned to them, in Southern Mogadishu anyway where the courts function)? For those who have fled, has it ever occurred to you (and others with similar views) that many still rightfully own their land (like my family members, all from different tribes)? That their homes are leased out by their family (even if a different “ilk†nonetheless they still do have immediate family in Mogadishu).

 

I know generations who’ve been uprooted by the invading ilk.

Yes I’m guessing we all do , but this is the problem we all seem to be stagnant in the past-times have moved on, if you want a piece of Xamar, brother you can get it. Just to give you a small example, after the two main tribes currently inhabiting Mogadishu, the two largest tribes are that of Somali Galbeed and Gedo. They live in many areas and have great stakes in the city. The bottom line is brother, this whole thing about Mogadishu been occupied and homes looted is so over-rated now-those people are generally gone and in their graves. There are a new breed of people, who are working hard for theirs so there is no need for us to keep on dwelling on issues which are no longer of such relevance because at the end of the day, if you want your land back, go and get it. If this does not happen, injustice occurs everywhere, it is xaraam and should be fought, but we as Muslims need to also be fair, there is no need to tarnish the city and the millions of people living there because a few evil men occupy a few homes and then paint it like it is an epidemic.

[Rokko]

^^ loool@ somali galbeed and gedo

 

Rahima, it is so funny how ya always mention Gedo's clan when you need a magical validation of your anti-puntland pro-USC arguments lol. Just my observation na'mean. Your words remind me of the famous Soomaali saying ... Awrkaa lagu kacsadaa. lol

 

Oh, this line also cracked me up ... "go get it".

 

Anways, go on ... sorry for the interrup.

[Rahima]

Ha?

 

Which part of this concerns PL? :confused:

 

you need a magical validation of your anti-puntland arguments

Should i tell you my mothers name? Just the family name would prove my stance on PL (i mean because by saying PL, it isn't the administration or even land which you speak of is it now dear brother ). Do you think it is possible for one to have negetive feelings towards ones mother ? Do you Mobb? Do you also believe that one could harbour negetive feelings towards a grandmother that raised and one was named after? Think about this before you make such claims in the future.

 

Also, feel more than free to interrupt more often, just be mindful in future to stick to the topic or even make some sort of sense

[Rokko]

^^ Mother huh? Good point my dear sister.

 

Hey, by the way, wasn't Caydiids mother/grandmother from Yeeys clan? I don't know but I think I heard there was some connection na'mean. Laakiin Soomalidu waxbay buunbuunisaa. Could be a lie na'mean.

 

Anyways, who knows. who cares na'mean.