Battle of sexes

[Jamilah]

What is going on? I sincerely doubt that I am the only one sensitive to the gender warfare currently brewing away on our little cyber community. I do not intend to pass judgment but will take the task upon myself of endeavoring to alleviate the damage done. I think more often than not a problem is simpler than it appears to be and as humans we love to complicate matters. So, naturally a simple problem requires a simple solution.

 

You must excuse me with some of the generalizations I am bound to make, for instance the observation that most of the time the girls are on the defensive on matters in which Islam has a strong stance. I mean what was the deal with the virginity topic. It simply is not a debatable issue. If you are a Muslim you must accept the fact that Islam forbids sexual relationships prior to marriage. I can almost hear the cynical murmurs which vehemently protest that none of us are perfect and as biniadam (mankind) we are inevitably going to detract from the straight and narrow path. That’s true enough, even though that is a pretty BIG mistake what bothers me is the fact that some of the girls actually defended their actions. What are you getting at? You impatiently ask, the thing that is concerning is when the girls justified their action s it was on the basis that the men do not guide their chastity and therefore why should they? This argument is so illogical that I cannot think of analogy that will magnify the idiocy of it. You yearn for equality among the sexes yet you are willing to throw away your morals simply because a man has. I hope the girls do not feel I am attacking them but when I last viewed that topic it was mainly the girls who were dismissing the message of the topic.

 

For the men….

 

I can understand how their arrogance and high handed manner can infuriate the women. Especially when (which is sadly the majority of the time) what they are saying has no Islamic basis. Let’s take as an example that court case in America with that Somali man who supposedly is the Shakespeare of Somalia. I recall many of the guys downplayed the seriousness of the crime when that topic was posted here many defending him and going to the extent that the woman’s mental state was questioned when a particular individual (male) asked what was the point of degrading yourself by going public. I can understand the outrage of such a naïve question considering I myself was incensed by it. It really makes you wonder. I mean the author of that misguided post has a mother (obviously) and a wife.

 

I mean do each gender say things just to get to other, or is what they say really coming from the heart. Because it is the former well that is easily fixed. However, if it is the latter a more deep understanding of our religion ISLAM is in need. So brothers and sisters try to get along and not start dissent for the mere sack of it.

[J.Lee]

I agree with the points you have raised but unlike you, I'm insensitive to it.

 

You yearn for equality among the sexes yet you are willing to throw away your morals simply because a man has.

Unfortunately, equality (why not be better?) to most females is achieved among the sexes only when women are able to do all that a man can do walaal and therein lays the problem. Instead of setting our own standard of judgement, we follow the same "masculine formula" that we complain oppresses us and is to blame for our "regression"

 

This type of mentality is the reason why a woman will never, ever, ever, and ever rule the free world. (Hil '08 anyone?) And why I strongly detest, though I agree with its basic foundation and objection, most forms of feminism and not to mention feminists.

[Naden]

I don't know about rule the world but women are ruling countries from Liberia to Chile and are heads of ministries in countries like the Philippines & Germany. In the free world, they run multimillion dollar companies, graduate in droves from universities and have political and economic ambitions that will simply explode in the coming years. Not quite rule the world, but get dangerously close.

 

In defense of feminism, basic rights like voting, access to medical care and education, and the inception of labour and family laws were championed by feminists among others. I'm not sure if they deserve to be detested as a lot of access we have as women was hard won by feminists.

 

 

Originally posted by Jimca Lee:

This type of mentality is the reason why a woman will never, ever, ever,

and ever

rule the free world. (Hil '08 anyone?) And why I strongly detest, though I agree with its basic foundation and objection, most forms of feminism and not to mention feminists. [/QB]

[Ibtisam]

There is a difference between equality and imitation, why you wanna imitate a skinny farah is beyond me, but i think whatever your going to do whether it be sex or jumping off a bridge should be done by your own choice and judgement based on what you think is correct and morally right not what everyone else is doing. Male and female are equal in the eyes of the law (human law and God's law), but their capabilities and roles are slightly different.

[codetalker]

Hey, great points ladies but the score remains the same:

 

Men 100 Women 50 (final score)

[Ibtisam]

^^^^100 what; camels :rolleyes:

 

yes i know 50 women can do 100 men's job; tell me something i did't know already PLz

[Mr.Faarax]

lol and they start the fight here too

[makalajabti]

Jimca Lee

 

If you can vote, study and work today it's because of the feminists you despise so much!

They fought for you!

 

Ungrateful woman.

[Jamilah]

^^ Surely Allah alone deserves our gratitude for the things he has blessed us with.

[J.Lee]

^Walaal bal u sheeg

 

As a Somali, what has feminism done for you? La soco all those rights you mentioned were already guaranteed to you by Allah. Now, Ooch ouch girls before you blow a casket, re-read what I wrote (most forms and its application, not the foundation).

 

Even though the Women Right's movement was something to be admired (and I do admire it), what feminists of today have done to Stanton's dream deserves my loathing and my contempt.

 

Like Ibtisim wrote:

There is a difference between equality and imitation (Preach!)

B.T.W Ruler of the Free world is a slang term for the President of the U.S walaal: I know there have many women who have held highly esteemed positions but that was beside the point.

[Naden]

Jimca Lee,

 

No one is going to blow a gasket, but kindly explain how the rights guaranteed by Allah have been physically granted to women and please put some thought into it. As for the 'ruler the world' statement, I understood what you alluded to but my examples were to show that the seat is not that far away for a woman.

[J.Lee]

Before I answer it, make me understand the relevancy of your question in regards to my prior posts (?)

 

After all, comprehension isn't just a fancy English word.

 

Again Jimca Lee wrote:

 

And why I strongly detest

,

though I agree with its basic foundation and objection

,

most forms of feminism

and not to mention feminists.

My fight isn't with Stanton, Anthony, Motts etc. just some of their successors

[Naden]

^ I did not miss your agreement with the basic foundations of feminism. I do comprehend much of what is written. What I don't understand is the feminism/feminists that you refer to and that are so hideous they deserve to be detested. This is the part of your post that people responded to. The modern day feminists that I read for are not the militant minority that many use to turn feminism into an f-word. This despite the work the is being done by feminists (who are mostly humanists) for equality in pay and social justice.

 

You don't have to answer any questions but a right guaranteed and a right garnered are two different things.

[J.Lee]

^And I do realize that: rights are granted when they are fought for but the question was for makalajabti who made the assumption that feminist fought for all women when those rights were granted. It wasn't until the Civil rights movement and Womanism (some womanists don't consider it a form of feminism, they believe it hasn't really done much for them!) that women of color were allowed to vote, attend school and etc.

 

 

What I don't understand is the modern/present day feminism that you refer to and that is so hideous it deserves to be detested.

This is what I refer to; sexually liberal feminism: socialist feminism: liberal feminism: and separatist feminism

 

These forms of feminism have taken this beautiful, admirable, and noble ideology and turned it into a mockery. Walaal, there isn't a woman in this world that is against fighting for women's right but there are women who abhor the way in which feminism is being applied today because for the simple reason that [the above form's] idea of equality is one of imitation, competition, coercion and/or sexual reform.

 

They have also adopted this "if you are not with us, you are against us" mentality: their very basis strives to cause an internal division amongst woman when one of basic principals of feminism was to unite women under one banner of sisterhood. It's beyond disgusting, and the reason why women, as I have stated earlier, will never rule the free world.

 

B.T.W

The comprehension comment was for me.

[Naden]

^ Okay. I'm not really sure there are any disagreements or agreement given that we're not defining any terms and exploring their examples.

 

This is what I refer to; sexually liberal feminism: socialist feminism: liberal feminism: and separatist feminism

 

I've always thought the basic foundations of feminism were entrenched in liberal and socialist ideals but all that is not important if no definitions/examples are being discussed. I gather these types of feminism exist left of a more conservative (traditional or orthodox?) feminism? In any case, my ideals are left of the left as a libertarian and anything that protects all my rights, including (especially) sexual freedom, ALL access to what society offers, and protects me from oppression is cool with me. It would be feminism, humanism, social justice or all as long as it protects my rights.

 

I disagree with you about women ruling the world. I think a woman will become President of the US but I've always thought it was a ceremonial position, reserved for those highly backed by financial and industrial interests. In general, they tend to be men of suspect intelligence (Bush, Reagan, Nixon?). When a woman is fit enough to be backed, she will become president. In the mean time, it is the wealthy/powerful women, albeit the few, who co-run the world.